Nibley City Planning Commission

And this is a special meeting tonight. We've got a bunch of, guests, at the meeting, which we're excited about. So with respect to getting the, the planning commission meeting going, first, we'll do a quick call of the the planning commissioners including staff. Nick

Kinskin? Lee Roberts, the planner.

Justin Long, the manager?

I'm telling him to make a little assistance that he required. Great. And then, we do have some members of the city council here. Do we need to wait for Larry or Justin? Are you gonna No. MC the city council meeting? They do it. Tell them that. Okay. We'll wait for those next items or the those following. The next item on the agenda is just approval of the meeting minutes, including the previous or excuse me, approval of the November 13 previous meeting, minutes of the planning commission and including the current agenda for us.

Wait. Should I approve?

Yeah. I have a motion to approve the agenda and the the last meeting minutes. The second. K. We have a motion to approve. Not seconded. And we'll just go to the roll of all in favor.

K. None opposed.

Okay. Thank you. So that that was approval for item number two. Now I'll move on to item number three, which is to address and I guess recognize that the city council is also participating in the meeting. So

I guess whoever City council.

Seeing how Amir is not here, maybe. So we will go call.

Thank you, K. We'll go to the next item on tonight's agenda, which is a joint Nibley City, I think, zoning commission and Nibley City Council, workshop where we have lovely partners with the Utah State University landscape architecture and environmental planning student project, specifically focusing on newly growing Middle East growing community assets, identity identity, and responsible design. So I'll turn it over to our friends at Utah State. Thank you.

Let's see.

What are your sponsors on the associate for customer practice? So I've been mostly for your mostly my premier practicing landscape architecture and planning. I came back about ten years ago to give back to Utah State, but it gave me actually, one of my professors, Gabe Nielsen, sitting with all caps. One of your new residents was a professor of mine in 1876. But this thing includes full circle. Nick Horace is in Aaron is a main amazing student in this very class five, six years ago. So we feel very welcome in this community, and we love the community, what we've learned about it. And we've got 13 students that have spent about ten weeks working on multi different scales. So looking at larger scale systems, lead lead to this conversation that we had in practice yesterday, getting ready for the presentation. And we're living in in a same evening. So sure. But he did ask me to say so when you operate in an academic environment, input from the city, goal is a larger vision looking into the future. It's important to have the latitude to plan and design on things that may not be in the ship of the city. So a lot of these concepts as as you guys saw when we presented in October, paid a certain license. That's not to suggest that any of this is cast in stone. I mean, it it allows us flexibility to really achieve a robust vision. So Dana's gonna come, introduce the whole thing, and then the students will take it beginning to end, and then we hope to have short queue session here. So experiment for it.

Good evening. We have a bioregional analysis planning and design class from Utah State University, and we are here to strengthen Nibley's identity. First,

Just a second. It should work now.

Thank you. First, we have everyone on the same page. We are currently sitting in the magenta dot at the center of this diagram. You will see this diagram throughout the presentation to help orient everyone. Inwood has a clear community vision. They want a vibrant community while protecting their identity, preserving natural spaces, and maintain the rural atmosphere. However, projections show the city's population is expected to triple in the next forty years. Such rapid growth would threaten this vision and turn nimbly into nothing more than a veteran community. Our project explores this conflict and proposes a path forward. We have five teams, each of which focuses on a different aspect of this program and comes together to create a comprehensive solution. The natural systems team focuses on the natural on maintaining natural systems that Italy is built upon. Open space team translate the natural systems into a network of parks and trails. The city center team has designed a central park, a part of the open space network. The complete neighborhood team lays out a residential area to accommodate growth and capitalize on Nibley's assets. And the town center team ties that in together the vibrant commercial and public core for the for Nibley. To understand the population growth, we examined Nibley's demographics. Nibley's growing new family oriented population with with a median income just higher than Utah's and housing that is mostly owned rather than rented. While graphs are useful, we have created a set of avatars based on the demographics. These statistically backed but fictitious families humanize the people of Nibley in a way that the chart can't and allow us to imagine how those spaces we create will be used. Families like the birds love the mountains, and they'll find value in the work of the natural systems team. Families like the Fieldings will love taking morning walks through the child system laid out at the the Open Space team. Families like the Rolands will love the various delights all throughout City Center Park. Families like the Ferris will have benefit from the affordability of the vibrant neighborhood created by the complete neighborhood team, and families like the Garrisons will be able to grow small businesses in the town center. We will now dive into our large scale teams.

Hello, everyone. We are the natural systems team, and so we spent this semester trying to find an answer to this question of how can natural system conservation aid the needs of every city. And we found that, first, this natural systems conservation helps us understand Italy's role within Cache Valley and how it is an important part of a market hydrological system. And the second, it helps us identify the city's critical natural assets. And third, it helps us create these connections between the the city's assets and the so so it plays a unique role in the pipeline ecosystem of Cache Valley. To understand this, we zoomed out of the current city limits of the annexation plan and looked at the city from the larger, sub watershed area. Started by looking at the rivers and streams in the area, as the rain as the as it rains, it snows with the foothills and the water runoff flows through nearly into to Pillar Marsh, where it eventually joins the Bear River and reaches its ultimate destination of the Great Salt Lake. So Nibley serves as a main corridor in the larger hydrological system, which lays the foundation for both the human and ecological systems as well. So now that we have a better understanding of the larger system and Nubile's role as a border and connector, we're able to zoom into the city and and see how we can help fulfill that role for the benefit of the system and the communities that live in Italy. We identified four major hydrological and ecological corridors running through the city following some of the rivers, streams, and canals. Along each of these, we look at areas of high ecological value and found opportunities for conservation. First, along the Blacksmith Fork River, there's an area there's an area of ecological importance as well as an area that is high in cultural importance. Along the mid loop now, in this ecological area, agriculture is apparent and thriving. The Hiram Slough features two ecological areas, one of that connects into the heart of the city and other ground, which is ground and its communities. And lastly, along the highway now in Highway 89, the area that sees a lot of traffic. Excuse me. And stand as a gateway for the city.

This opportunity this brings an opportunity to a lot of travelers to the city of Midway.

For these areas, there are two implementation strategies based on the current development steps of these areas. So areas one and two are gonna be more retroactive. These areas exist within city limits. The goal of these areas is to stitch stitch together green infrastructure back into the existing fabric. And areas three, four, and five, are located in the annexation areas. These areas are largely agriculture or open space. So this gives us the opportunity to establish conservation efforts now so we can guide the future growth of the natural systems provided by the states that might

have been made in the past.

So So as we look at these five areas and what types of conservation efforts should occur, each of these areas each of these areas are established with the neighboring connections to the other areas. Area one is a great opportunity for community growth with areas of conservation and recreation connecting to the South. Area two supports agriculture and establishes Blacksmith or river as the backbone of Nibley. Area three will establish connecting trails to the heart of Nibley and the linear part along the high road slough. Area 4 sets aside land that balances human land use and and ecological function. And then lastly, with Area 1 on the East, Area 5 will act as the western acre foot city in the gateway, showing a place where agriculture, ecology, and community arrive. Together, these areas connect community with the city's ecological and cultural assets while protecting protecting and strengthening.

Alright.

Of those five areas, we will now be focusing in on Area 1. So how can we implement these conservation efforts in this area and throughout Italy? We can do this by utilizing green infrastructure and conservation strategies. Areas where agriculture and wetlands come together can support things like ad lands, trails, canals, wetlands, and native plants. And then areas existing natural areas can be preserved and enhanced through things such as recreation, preserved wetlands, stormwater, bioswales, pedestrian trails, and native plants. Also, in areas where wetlands and development meet, we should utilize things like preserved habitat, water wise and native plants, stormwater bioswales for cleaning and draining water, permeable paving, tree lined streets, and residential housing. So creating and reinforcing ecological community connections provide many benefits such as social and community benefits reflecting the identity of the city, environmental and ecological benefits that promote a vibrant and active city, and that can only get health benefits that connect the community with nature.

Okay. So as previously mentioned, it's growing, and the city government has faced that 82,000 people will be here by by 2040. During this transition planning is a critical importance. Here we can see traditional development compared with a model that has space preservation in mind. Often public spaces is undervalued, though it has It's economic and otherwise. Cities with robust open space programs, offer the best quality of life and are more desirable to move to as shown here by a nationwide study in trend in moving trends done by the five moving company. As cities, that offer open space, see happier residents and lower health care costs. Shown here are some statistics for the benefits Nibley residents could gain from a robust open space system. So keeping all that in mind, here are some design frameworks for the open space and trails program for Nibley City. To do large system planning, I began using the foundational ecological priorities from our conservation team and located the spines of the system along of the trail system along these important waterways. Using these ecological paths is important because it mitigates the fracturing created by human development, particularly highways. So using the biorigional systems, we can overcome these fractures and connect neighboring municipalities to one another to a large and to larger systems, like the Bonneville Shoreline Trail. This in turn creates more opportunity for funding and use. So cities across The US have recognized green loops as a way to repair urbanized and disconnected systems. Here are a wide range of different cities and some green loops that they've designed. We have Atlanta, one in Houston, one in Portland. And I propose that through designing green loop trails, before development and putting them into the general plan, you could avoid more difficult and costly projects down the road. From a practical standpoint, making loops here means using the hydrologic spines running across the valley and connecting them back to each other from east to west. So a low impact opportunity for this is the canal systems that run perpendicular to these waterways. For non canal connections, the simplest way to put your design trail system into development into development agreements via the general plan and have each section created by developers as they buy and build land. So this method can be used similarly for parks design by identifying where your parks will be first before development and using the framework to make sure developers are not who aren't community members, create desirable living spaces for your residents when they build. And so here's some parcels. By using GIS to organize desirable parcels and trails data by land use, a located land would be suitable for different park types tied to broader trail systems and their individual context. Types of parks are classified by the amenities they offer and area distance they provide those amenities services to. So diversification of park programs is really critical to the usefulness of parks and their success in the community, And that brings us to the phasing and prioritization plan. Here's priority area one, which is a regional park. This is a large park, the largest park typology with a large and diverse program. It's connected to the larger trail network along with a blacksmith core grouper with opportunities to connect to Logan City and the Bonneville Shoreland Trail. Next is the core green loop in the agricultural annex area, which connects to the south side of the valley and and eventually across the highway as well, completing the broad and interconnected system that could be multi jurisdictional and, provide a lot more opportunity for use. And the last recommendation here is to complete the connection with the Bonneville Shortland Trail. It's an ill invaluable opportunity to hook this system to a beloved state trail system. So now we're going to zoom in to the specific part of Nibley where all of you have identified a platform for that hub. Here you can see these ecological ecological problems along with social infrastructure, roads, churches, schools, and bus stops. So now I'll give you a little sneak peek of the Newtown Center site. In particular, I'll be showing the open space design recommendations that connect the site to the broader context of the city. So first, when entering the city on work, main right before the grid, putting gateway signage that proudly announces the start of Nibley as you see the river in the town for you. The next feature in accessible paved loop that runs along. Short gap connects the existing rivers by a trail with. Next, we have traveling onward down the trail. We'll lead through a big passage tunnel that is well lit and allows students a safer route to cross back into the city after school. The tunnel feature big hall boxes, effective lighting, and providing an extra opportunity for local art and Instagramable routines. And then onto the other side of town, we complete our river loop trail with the connection into Stokes Nature Park and through it leading directly to directly across 2600 to the new City Center Park. And then I'm just gonna key up this, next section. So the next three groups are gonna be staying in this zoomed in scale and talking about the detailed design interventions between between twenty six and thirty two hundred South and Main Street. So we'll be referencing the streets. We'll be referencing the ecology and social social infrastructure that we've already talked about, and then we'll be adding new circulation, a regional park, residential housing, and a city core center. So now I'll turn it over to our park design team.

So we were tasked with designing a new city center park for Nibley. And the unique thing about this park is that we got to be the ones that bridge the gap between the two groups that you've just heard of with all of the ecological processes and factors, and then we get to bridge that with the groups that will come after us with how the people fit in in that social aspect. And this is the area that we were looking into for designing that park. When we were here a few months ago, we began with this question of what environment do you want to raise your children and grandchildren in? That is the same question that we want you to think of tonight. Here we see that Nibley is a growing community. There are a lot of families that are moving in and a lot of people that are beginning their lives here or continuing their lives. Recently, Nibley has gone and done a survey about how their parks are currently structured, and this feedback has shown that there are some requested amenities and programs. And a lot of these things are being able to be served by open space and natural parks that people can be able to walk around and enjoy. Between the about 84 acres of parkland, Nibley currently has neighborhood parks, which are amenity based, and open space parks, which are more natural areas and passive recreation. Okay. These this map shows those parks with a half mile buffer. That can show us kind of the areas that the community itself is really getting involved with those parks. This is the location that our park that we designed is in, and it's able to provide a lot more connectivity for those open spaces and natural systems that were talked about. And it will be located next to the areas that the groups will talk about for the city center after. When we zoom into that area, we have Ridgeline. We have Ginny's pit stop, the Nibley city offices, and then this is the area highlighted in red that we are our design is currently at. Phase one of a park is currently being built just south of the that location. When we look at the amenities that are provided there, we see pump track. We see seating and pavilions. We see water features and pickleball courts available to the public. And so with our site, we also wanted to look into those natural features that have the other groups have spoken about. And when we overlay those wetland areas, we saw this pattern. We have a about a 50 foot buffer around the wetland areas to help preserve the integrity of those wetlands. The idea would be that we both we dig down into those areas that are wetlands so that we can have water that emerges from the water table. That way, we can have water on the site that people can enjoy as it may be. The removal of that water can go into these locations to build areas up so that we can have little islands so that we can start building infrastructure and placing park amenities, and that's what that looks like together. This is that diagram that I was just talking about. And with that, we looked into how we wanted to connect people north, south, east, and west to be able to enjoy the new amenities. From there, we created a secondary and tertiary trail network so that people can be able to wander around and enjoy this area at their own leisure.

Here you can see the master plan we developed using those islands, and we separate it into three predominant areas, one being nature recreation, one being a social core, and the other being an educational hub. So we're gonna dive into those. The first is what we call the school or the educational hub. With the Niddley Elementary School currently being extremely used and in high capacity, as well as the thousands of kids that this new development will bring, we see a huge need for a new school, and this conserves a new education. So there we have a modern barn style school that pays homage to the agricultural history of Italy as well as a educational hub type park that we'll dive further into, a soccer field and basketball courts to serve that school, as well as a river trail that connects to the new development and phase one of the park design as well as the top is Jeff's Avenue as well. So here, you can see the courtyard from the top of that school looking into the rest of the park as well as the educational hub, which would feature a dinosaur or a philosophy based playground, physics playground, and a nature of winter. Here we can see an outdoor classroom with greenhouses that would also be in that area. And then here we have sort of a three d cutout with how the interaction with the boardwalks, the trails, the layouts. Then we jump into what we like to call the canyon, which is the nature recreation area. We call it a canyon because it's designed to be reminiscent or replicative of, Blacksmith Fork Canyon. So this is gonna be a very nature oriented area. We're doing that by creating both nature trails and adding gazebos to large planted areas that we use. Trees that are good for natural bird habitat, like Cache Valley. So that'll bring native bird as well as other species to the park. Here we have a boardwalk that goes over that open water to connect those areas as well as a more

ring type shaped pond that serves as a fishing pond for the rest of the year and a skating rink during the winter.

And we also have a dock that jets out into that water and a Central Ave. This is a rendering of what that sort of major trail area would look like. We have the gazebo gathering areas and then a view of the dock. There you can see another three d view of that. I'm gonna jump into what we call the island or the social hub. We call it the island because the wetlands naturally shape or develop around it, creating a sort of island look like structure with a an existing river that actually flows through the site or creek that we could tie into it. Here we have the connection by both road and boardwalk to this town center, which we can help with later. And the top half of the park is designed to, take inspiration from Blacksmith Fort Canyon. So here we have a wetland based or themed playground as well as grassy berms directly with a sort of rolling hills or mountains. We have watchtowers to look over the creeks and wetlands, and then a highly requested amenity by the community, which is a central splash pad. The second half of the central island is designed to pay homage to the agricultural history of Midway by sort of replicating farm style plots. So here we have a farm style main pavilion as well as pathways and planting to sort of replicate or create that farm style plot. Then we also have same volleyball, horseshoe, and pavilions. This is a rendering of what that would look like. Closer view. And this is another area for the the North that would actually border 2600 South where we'd be adding basketball and pickleball courts. There's a three d view of the type of viewscape that you get from that watch tower as well as the boardwalk. And we'd like to conclude by saying that there's a huge opportunity here with the low water table or the high water table to create a really outstanding ecological center park that we think has both into community values and serves as a really pinnacle destination for not only Midway, but all of CashNow. So we'll move into the residential cleanest.

We are the complete team. Our site is located within that same block directly east from the City Center Park. Once again, cash value is growing fast. About 2% a year with 11,600 new homes needed by 2030, housing is already tight. The Logan area ranks a 178 nationally in affordability, and demand keeps rising. As demand rises, Nibley's outward growth had a risk reinforcing its rules by community as well as spreading into productive farmland and weakening the town's rural edge and agricultural identity. In order for Nuplu to meet housing needs while remaining authentic to the character of town and taking advantage of natural assets, we have designed a complete neighborhood with compact mixed use development and a well designed public realm ensuring the community life and enhance access to nature and guide future growth. This is located to take advantage of the confluence of assets between Blacksmith Fork, Richland High School, the town center, the city center, the proposed elementary school, the city offices, and Stokes Nature Center. By concentrating growth around these amenities, it allows me to capitalize on its strength and make efficient use of existing infrastructure. Middle half those middle housing, like duplexes, townhomes, and cottage core, is a popular method to address the housing crisis. A study by the Utah Foundation found Utah's attract its middle housing when it fits the style and scale of of a neighborhood and especially when it appears to be single family. The survey also found that small multifamily, like, is more attractive to utines than large multifamily. Envision Utah found that 46% of Utah has been willing to accept middle housing in their neighborhood, with an even greater percent willing to accept it in in their city and in their immediate neighborhood. An analysis in the field of the current opportunities for middle housing are limited. A lot sizes, lot bits, parking requirements, and setbacks is currently stated in the initially code or large, requiring the development of large, spread out buildings, getting a plan, and increasing housing costs. Even in this simple diagram, small adjustments to the size and spacing of icons allow an additional house to fit on this slide. Imagine how big of a difference these changes can make in the rural world. Another issue in the code is that the area where where residential is permitted in the city is extremely small. By creating only one type of housing, there is zero flexibility to accommodate different household needs. We created an example for base code for our neighborhood by by specifying the types of houses permitted in the area and defining the dimension they can fill. The scale and character of houses can be tailored to fit the wants and needs of individual households in the community. Other considerations for code include meaningful and accessible open spaces, such as parks, follows, pathways, and preserved natural landscapes. Landgaping would made it from water by plants during personality systems mentioned earlier and add beauty, as well as even how to look at vehicle access. And with reduced currently minimums to prioritize people who perform spatially, creating streets that are lined with porches rather than drivers.

So here we're located at that corner of the city center park in what the town center team will start as the beverage probably later. And instead of form following function, we really want to embrace the concept of function following form. The biobial and commercial and residential land uses to coexist within defined spatial parameters. Form based code enables the development of a complete neighborhood. So This approach keeps essential services like grocery stores, local restaurants, and small shops within walking distance. By concentrating commercial public uses along green roads, the neighborhood offers convenient access to jobs and amenities while maintaining a cohesive identity. Zooming in a bit, another important thing that we wanted to do was ensure that the design of our paper could prioritize the balance between character and accommodating the growing demand for. So using form based code, we regulate building scale, setbacks, and and it can all be made to create an activated streetscape. So, really, what you'd wanna do is reduce the setback just a few feet or require landscaping instead of just grass bridges, and that can really create a more pleasant environment for people to live in. Here, looking at the edge of, City Center Park and the neighborhood, A key priority of the design was to, prioritize public open space and sharing safe and walkable streets. So the neighborhood uses a grid layout with 300 foot blocks that allow for easy navigation rather than the 600 foot blocks that we're accustomed to in Logan. The streets are designed to balance between car lanes and sidewalks as well as bike lanes, while focusing on the walkability and bike safety. And major sections of the City Center Park are directly accessible from the streets, promoting that interaction and connection with people in the public space rather than just having that public park behind someone's house, behind fences. Having it open to the street really changes the dynamic of the community and who feels that they belong or are encouraged to enter the open space. So a key design consideration was the scale and density of buildings to create a neighborhood that blends naturally with Midway. So we group buildings of similar heights, density together, creating a transition from broader homes to taller structures at the center. And that approach uses perceived density, so how dense the neighborhood feels, rather than actually is to maintain a comfortable open space, open atmosphere, even in areas that do actually have higher density. So here, you can just see we can transition between single family cottage court, which are independent standalone houses, but several of them on one lot to duplexes, which is two houses on a shared lot. And we scale up slightly to townhomes with more shared green space that actually front onto the park, so they have that they feel that that's accessible. They can go down to the city center garden plots. We've also got the median multiplex, which are more concentrated around the live, around the commercial centers where you've got live work and essentially a bus stop available for people to be able to access, go to and from work, go to and from shops. So building up the density from the parks all the way to that virtual core. And here you can see our master plan. A key aspect of our design was also to make sure it stays appropriately within the wider neighborhood. So to the south of that block, we have the Ridgeline Park development, and they have single family homes as long as well as condos. And so we wanted to seamlessly blend that typology up into our neighborhood. So the yellow there, you can see is more of a single family cottage core duplexes, and then that blends into a more dense system of townhomes. And the same at the Northwest corner, we've got large log residential on 3rd

That's twenty six years. Okay. They're right there.

I might be getting to that. It's 3,203 blocks off of

Okay. So you've got 2,600 at the top there, and that just blends into the larger residential with more single family, bringing you into the site. And to summarize, we've actually got about 300 housing units in this neighborhood ranging from one point one one point four gross to 3.4 net dwelling units per acre all the way for single family, all the way up to 14 gross to 28 net dwelling units per acre. Overall, this site, including the park, is a 108 acres, and nearly 50 acres or 46% is open space. And it's a meaningful public open space to capitalize on these natural assets. And I'll turn it to the town center team.

Okay. Hi, everyone. Thank you for being here this evening. We are the fifth and final team, the town center. So upon looking at Nibley for the Nibley for general plan update, we noticed that the proposed town center was, located between 2600 3207. And during our analysis, which we'll get into momentarily, we confirmed that this is an ideal location for the future town center as it is situated within existing, ongoing development and adjacent to many of our key assets. The town center is an exciting future plan for Nibley that will not only be sensitive to surrounding natural systems and assets, but will bolster a vibrant and connected economic core for the community of Nibley and surrounding municipalities. The town center plays a crucial role in cultivating identity for the community, connection to the surrounding systems and confluence of assets, and overall variety of locally based retail businesses. Through our analysis, we look took a look at a variety of elements that impact the chosen town center site. Our number one goal was to connect to the surrounding natural systems as noted in previous teams as well as locksmith work. We also took a look at u dot's average daily trips in order to analyze traffic patterns and volume in and around the site. So along Main Street, the average daily trips right now are looking at 21 to 25,000 per day, and this was a huge driver of our ultimate site selection along Main Street. We also wanted to prioritize connections to Richland High School as well as the nearby religious institution, Ginny's Soda Shop, and the Nibley City offices where we currently sit. After taking a look at, Nibley City's active transportation plan, we proposed somewhat of a new design for Main Street, and this would aid in pedestrian and cyclist comfort as well as prioritize safe vehicular movement in and around our city. We also believe that the introduction of a new intersection feeding into our Center Street is very crucial for the existence and success of our overall town center. This would funnel traffic off Main Street and onto a comfortable humanized street, allowing for greater behavior access and pedestrian and cyclist comfortability.

We also want to highlight a few more components of the town center, especially focusing on the commercial areas, which are essential to the success of the entire project. These are strategically located to strengthen the confluence of assets, allowing people to move seamlessly between the various attractions on both ends and feathering into the complete neighborhood and the bike trails and network, creating a connected community at home that doesn't exist anywhere else in Midway. We also worked with a retail expert to understand feasibility needs for Midway's scale of market for the commercial core. And this conversation revealed a strategy for 50% homegrown style businesses from locally. That might include salons, florists, bakeries, arts, and such as Okay. And the strategy calls for a few retail anchors, one of which could be, the starter club. This is a fan style diner. Think downsides version of Maddox, sort of a vibe, comfortable, homey, welcoming atmosphere where they might have trivia on one night of the week. With a view right down to the river, it would connect to the trails that lead directly to Ridgeline High. And the plaza out front would then lead you over to the town center block to the left. At the Center Street's prominent corner sits the Barnstable Emporium, which we locally call the Hayshed. Next to the Hayshed is locally owned burger joint and a corporate account centers, followed by some small commercial spaces, which would include the local businesses, and this would also introduce every opportunity for team jobs in a fun local environment. The Nisha is an indoor co op market. It's a great place for moms to come snacks local produce or some baked goods and for kids to meet up for a snack and hang out, especially during the winter months. The main entrance features and Instagrammable, I was the Nibley moment with the giant n that was on there. This next view illustrates the spill out area in the back plaza with the fire pit, the lawn space, outdoor market area, and this closet space also at notes The library plaza, just next

word.

So the library was a big part of our town center, and we proposed it to be situated at second half a section off Center Street, drawing people into the site and acting as a vibrant node to facilitate education and connection. The library features an outdoor plaza, an event and gathering space, a community garden, and an outdoor learning space attached to the daycare. The library provides another community asset that intensifies activity transitions from the complete neighborhood, reaching throughout the surrounding blocks. This space is accessible and available to all ages and connected to the adjacent pedestrian street in order to facilitate community events. The community garden provides a space for education and stewardship as well as an opportunity for members of the community to participate, and take ownership within this space. The gathering lawn space provides opportunities to feature pollinator species and draw on Nibley's rich biodiversity. The circular form of the space is also a tribute to the Shoshone peoples who historically stewarded this land and held a deep spiritual connection to the medicine wheel. The medicine wheel aids in the understanding of creation, the four directions, and and life cycles. We felt like this was a key theme in our town center, the renewal and and, connection to the library as a whole. Finally, our Red River Jordan anchors the West end of the town center and provide a family friendly outdoor hub for residents. This also serves as the gateway to the surrounding open space and the park. With seating opportunities and seasonal food, beverage or seasonal food and beverage, This space will act as a note for activity for all ages. Artwork walls will be integrated on natural walls, and overhead lighting helps to extend hours of use. The park adjacent setting will connect visitors to nature while supporting community gatherings and enhancing local cultural vibrancy. So to draw back to the previous four teams, we our goal is to create seamless connections that can create a connected core that reflects and builds on the community's values, traditions, and identities.

Thank you. And we'll turn it over to the quick q and a.

Right.

Yeah. We really appreciate all the work that you all put into the project. I think I've heard a new term to use in city government meetings, Instagrammable. Maybe that means I'm getting old, but I have no idea. That's something new new vernacular to think about, I guess, as we discuss things like this. So maybe we'll turn it over to the council first. It's such a young sport. Work. Instagrammable. Oh, it used to be a callback mall. Yeah. It's. Anyways, Kathleen, if you wanna get us started with any thoughts that that you might have based on what we've seen tonight?

First of all, I just appreciate all the time, everything that you thought that we've really been enjoyable to imagine that Sydney could have connectivity that is based not just on that's that's based upon the the environment around us, and and that has deep foundations to it because I think that's something that's really appealing to our community is wanting to be connected, not just by road. And and I like the way you put that together. I wish we could pass it out to all our residents so that they could have an idea of what the problem would be.

Yeah. Just kind of I think what Kay was saying. I I like that you didn't have a lot of these third space that's a space that's not school, that's not home. Their space, and and I think we're really lacking that inner city. And and part of that's just because, you know, commercial hasn't naturally progressed down the stretch yet. So so finding ways to, like what do you guys think are good ways that we as a city can try to entice commercial to move this direction? I think a lot of commercial developers might say, we need rooftops. You know, before we can put up something and we need people passing the storm. What are how do you what ideas do you guys have about how do we create this to be a place where marketing wants to come? As well as where fans wanna be.

I think one thing that we really liked to address that was to kind of start small. That's that's one reason we had kind of the phased approach. And so with the Emporium style, that is a way to kind of gather a bunch of different local businesses together. Instead of starting with, like, one giant business, we start small and put it right on that quarter there. And that we thought that was a smart idea because it pulls like, it has it pulls from the high school. It pulls from the highway. It pulls from that, residential development just south, and so it already has the high traffic volume. And we feel that the high traffic volume is pretty important to make it successful. And then also just once people find out it's a cool place to be, then that's another reason about the institutes to be Great. Social care is pretty powerful. So those are some of our thoughts on that. Thank you.

I I know I appreciate that you're trying to link our

swamp or wetlands into an asset. So I appreciate your your the thought in in there, you know, the

I I hope we can give you a grade in giving you an honor. I think you did a great job.

Yeah.

K. We'll we'll turn the the questions and comments to the banking machine. Shor, do you have anything on your end you'd like to discuss? First of all, beautiful presentation.

Extremely cohesive and complete.

Not just the town center area, but the the overall idea from the the trail system and the conservation areas putting it all together.

If if if,

Niddly, as the city decides to go this way and once we fulfill this vision, I think, it will

be

one of

if not the best place to live in in cash value, but not it is absolute strength. And if we had a concept of place like that, I would

immediately move there. It's it's my house and be right there. One one of the things that was said,

you had mentioned

you came up with, like, a form based code to kind of envision that area. Do you have, like, an outline of that actual farm based code or just kind

of big We do indeed. We have our posters over here, and I me and Jessica spends a lot of time doing a lot of research looking at cities like Minneapolis, who have very successful form based codes studying the missing middle handbook, which is a one of the leading resources and put together some numbers in a very large chart that we know will not fit into a presentation. But it is there to your feedback.

Awesome. I will then check it out. Thank you. Tyler, anything? No. No. Great presentation. Yeah. Yeah. Hopefully, hopefully, we can continue to create a community background.

Yeah. It was a great presentation. I think I've been somewhat similar to one of the Steamboat Colorado, but you can't afford to move there, but they have the natural resources of their scheme and the pump. You're trying to capitalize on our natural resources. She mentioned them at the water table for the natural resource. So especially if you're digging a ball of three d d. Yeah. But in Capilano and and it's similar with Chicago, but they're they're they're reversing direction of it. They have kayaking and places to walk, and they also have Lake Michigan. They go to it with the spears and their face impact, and they try to get the natural resources. And the commercial partners in Miracle Line, I thought of some fantastic, but I just shop, and I don't like shot. And, of course, I'm one of girls, so what will you do? We shot. And so but a great vision. Maybe not to see that happen, but that takes time. It's not in operation by a lot of other entities. Yeah.

That's good shot. Yeah. One thing I appreciate about going through an exercise like this with a with a class and a resource that you that you all have provided is kind of just an unbiased or unconstrained idea on how to approach an area. Right? Like, I maybe somebody you've never even been intimately before for this project. And so I think one thing I appreciate is, I mean, I'm not sure what kind of direction you may have got from Levi or anybody else, but just, you know, a group of people who kinda let the facts or constraints that a site might provide and then let that kind of drive division on how to achieve a a uniform goal or vision that you might have as as as you work together. Right? And and, like, Tyler and Claire said, you know or or maybe it was or, you know, executing something like this at at our level often takes time and opportunity, right, and maybe a little bit of luck too, frankly. But for us or for me personally, it's just it's neat to see even just to the the level of detail that you have taken the design and even the idea of kinda, like, creating an environment or or, you know, even those design elements that that we could even borrow in the future, whether it's a site like this or maybe a feature part or anything like that down the road. So just wanted to reiterate a lot of what everyone else has said. Thank you. I know the kind of work it takes to put together, like, the project like this. We appreciate it. We appreciate it. So I don't know if Steph, you guys have anything. Oh, yeah. I wanna recognize mayor Jacobson in the back as well. Mayor, did you have any thoughts or anything? Come up with the mic.

I know you're trying to be incognito back there with the We're on YouTube.

Larry, we're on YouTube. So

Thanks.

I'll echo what these guys say that now it's up to us trying to figure out how to get this.

Great.

Levi, I don't think we'll leave.

I really appreciate the group. Really impressed by all the work you've done. This is this is really inspirational for us. Are you are you all gonna leave us with the the posters here? Or I I know I I would like to take some more time to just We decided to get a new public involved,

but this would be best medium to lead you with hard copy on the board. Digitally, all those are available. Right. Thank you. And I just wanna say I've been working for about forty five years. So I learned a lot of lessons. I've learned that a community like this can accomplish this if you want to. These students actually investigated the feasibility of a number of these things, including contacting you about the intersection, always involving Levi in the process. We talked with specialists in small commercial and retail activity, and she was, like, super enthused about this. And the thought of Barone is from Broom City. I said, what is Maddox to Broom City? He said, it's It's the mascot. Oh my god. It is. What a great idea to shrink that concept. Yes. I don't know if you guys are aware of Raleigh's and Santa Claus, But Rowley's is that place where produce and, you know, and quick buy, grab and go. So just there's a place where, as Aaron said, the community punched together as a third place. So all of these things can be created, but you have to have the will and the connect communicating to the community what those possibilities are. And we thank you so much for giving us the opportunity to investigate this in this wonderful community. The people involved here couldn't be right there. Just an awesome opportunity. I think we still Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. One more question. Yeah.

Based on the thing that you had mentioned,

was any developers either commercial and or residential like, did you guys any developers about, like would this be a project that you think you could cancel out and and move forward on? You know, we might have had Guy and I met Cheeseburgers down place called

what is it called? Under Cook's Underground.

And we said, would you be interested in a place like Midway that make the best cheeseburger in the valley? These are the places that are attracting people. They don't need, you know, companion or huge investment. That little thing that's on Logan on Federal Avenue, back where the tithing are used to be. Those are all succeeding because it's really good opportunity. So other than this woman that I've worked with in projects in Austin, Texas, San Diego, we said, let's scale this down to a place like Nibley. And she really gets involved in the Internet in terms of influencers. And so I I put the influencer on. Emily said, you know, let's think about what what is the value system, belief system? Where do people eat? What do they celebrate? Came up. Santaquin came up. Fruit. Bringing the, you know, the people from the fruit, you know, high highway. Getting that kind of vibe in Italy is, I think, we think where it's at. So we we we kinda kept it real down on the populist view of of this rather than you're not gonna get a big developer. So and I don't think you want me. Right? I think you want people to really the floors, the salon person. This is an awesome place that you've got. And I think, you know, a semblance of what these guys would get on I'm gonna be proud of them. It really knocked it out.

Other questions? Thank you. I think that's it for us. Does the audience

get that?

Sure. Go ahead. Absolutely. Go ahead. You have a question?

Okay.

First, is is Instagram is the synonym for. Also,

No. I don't even have one. Right now, it could go under

there's opportunity that it could go under a not the highway, but that ridgeline where you drive in. There's plenty of space for it. The trail, it, like, almost goes under running. It just pops right up. So then that's the place that we're connected to where the disc golf board is. Yeah. Right in front. So they would be continuing to sidewalk off there and go at that and then coming down where the river already goes underneath the Highway. Okay.

There were 500 communities in the Inner Mountain West would die to have that woods and that black smoke before we come through there for everyone's suffer club. I mean, they've died for that. You know? They have that asset in your communities. And you drive around, you don't want to play.

Really cool stuff.

Thank you so much. Thank you, Aviso. Thank you. Alright. We'll move on to the next item on the agenda before the city city council that you need to formally adjourn your meeting.

Larry, please.

Yeah. Thank you. Appreciate it.

If it's okay.

Yeah. They did awesome. Maybe I'll get the

let me just we're doing session.

Thanks,

Wait. Are we did you say we're taking a recess? Or

So I'm like,

Okay. I'm gonna yeah. Do you wanna do you wanna just announce it, Claire? So we know. On mute. So no one online heard me the first part as well. So looking at improving our connectivity standards as well, that's that's something that that we've we've had a goal to do for a little while now, but incorporating that. We we plan on doing that in our update to our transportation master plan. And then looking at our more regularly updating our functional classification map that kind of provides a backbone of our transportation system. And this last one, considering using roundabouts or mini roundabouts as a preferred intersection at unsign signalized intersection, and there's it goes into more detail of some of the benefits of the of that approach. There's a housing section here, and it, like, it it really is closely mirrors the the process of the moderate income housing plan that the the state requires. Some of the things that are recommended and and and it's it's a lot of this is a continuation of things that that we've been working on as a city is considering rezones to facilitate the production of moderate income housing focus on focus those in in planned commercial and mixed use areas, implementing zoning incentives for monitoring different units. It's something we've discussed. We we haven't incorporated that into our code, but that's recommended here. With ADUs, continue to track ADUs and potential barriers. ADUs are accessory dwelling units or and then consider eliminating impact fees for ADUs. And then this last one, just partnering with other organizations such as Bragg and neighborhood nonprofit, provide, additional affordable housing opportunities. Parks, open space, and rec. A lot of this also refers to our our master plan, our parks, open space, and recreation master plan. But and within the plan focuses on expanding public facilities and community pro pro programming by exploring an opportunity for rec center. And further, you know, that this is obviously something the city's engaged in right now. Now it's for events, organizations, activities. Further promoting tools to incentivize open space preservation. So this you know, whether it's our open space subdivision, our transfer development rights ordinance, or other tools to to conserve open space, just promoting those tools, and then support connected trails and and greenways. I I didn't mention it, but on on the future land use map, it actually shows a A potential green way that, and, you know, that that would be in support of our our active transportation plan and the trails that are recommended there. For the economic element of the plan. And stresses, ensuring financial sustainability for the city, addressing revenue and expenses, and the city's general fund and financial plan. Coordinating with economic development and entities such as Bragg, USU, and Bridgeland, focusing commercial growth and key nodes with with buffers. So a along Highway 89 Main Street, town center area, 3200 South and and 4400 South. And, one one recommendation is to update economic development strategic plan. It was last updated in 2013, so it's quite old and I I it's this is something that this we we've started to talk about economic development within the general plan, but we re really to dive in and focus on, you know, what the city's resources and what we can can and should do and what we should focus on for economic development, it really takes us diving into a strategic plan, and we've already started ways that we could we could do that. Increasing housing supply to match demand. So I as I mentioned, those and, you know, as as Aaron pointed out in the last, last agenda item, rooftops, really are are a big driver of of commercial growth. And so supporting increasing housing in in near these these envisioned commercial areas. Well, well, preserving area for for commercial uses as well. And then the city should promote housing options to ensure sustainable growth. There's some of those recommendations. Lastly, water use and preservation. I think I think we received a comment that this seemed a little bit Out of place in in some ways, this isn't. This is actually a new element required by the state. So just so you understand for a general plan, there's actually no four elements required by the state. One is land use. Second is transportation. Third is moderate income housing and then fourth, which was, I think, two years adopted is this water use and preservation element.

The.

The we technically aren't required to have this element till we reach 10,000, but with our current, you know, growth trajectory, that's likely to be in a short time. So we did include this in the scope and and and, really, it focuses on. Ways that we can conserve water through through best practices with as as we grow in the community. So encouraging landscape and conservation for new developments. We're already doing a lot of these things, but, you know, supporting rate structures and rebate programs that reward conservation and continuing to implement low impact development to recharge groundwater. So these these are all incorporated into the general plan, and and it there's an analysis on based upon our, you know, what's on our future land use map map and what our projected growth is, how much water that's expected to to take and and ways that we can conserve as as we do that. So that's all I've got. It is it is staff's recommendation that the, the planning commission recommend approval to city council of of this general plan.

Great. Thank you, Levi. With that, we'll move forward with the, public hearing portion of this agenda. I don't think anyone signed up for public comment, on the sign up sheet, but if anyone in attendance has any anything they'd like to approach the podium and have a public comment about this at least these general plan. Please please go ahead. Just state your name and address for the record, and then, certainly,

we'll speak up. My name is Rick.

It's the 66 Yes. We live right, you know, right in here kind of an area. But one question. This is Can you get large lots and this is smaller lots. And why is these larger lots and these are smaller lots? Because this is all added culturally here. There's probably thousands of acres of your the annexation that's there's both of that. And we're being built on first, there's on two sides of the farm. There's another company maybe on the south side. So on three sides up there, 11 acres. And I'm afraid more so on the south side of the property that is gonna grow houses on third acre houses in the backyard. I forgot to write it again. Sorry.

Frank, can you go to the microphone? Just I think we might have a few people online that can't hear you when you're over there. Even though I was on mute for, like, fifteen minutes. So kinda

Yeah. What you said on the tree side, it was a bit of

a being. And then the south side of the Westex where we built them six years ago, we're close to our property and we need some side of it. The developer, he could build third acre ones right up to boundary. And then to me, it's in you know, a little bit. But can you guys do anything? Maybe can you tell the developer to maybe give a buffer, like, some kind of buffer, like, there's an amp shelter over there. You know? They can get a buffer of this year maybe from their from their project.

Yeah. And so, Frank, just

see it.

Yeah. No. I just so so just some sort of rules for for public meetings. Right? So in a public comment period, typically, you know, citizens are allowed to come and speak their mind, ask questions, but it's not necessarily, like, a direct question answer kind of environment. But we will discuss I mean, when we move on from the public comment period, certainly, we'll discuss you know, we can address any questions, you know, in during the discussion part of the the meeting. That's just kind of rules of a a good public meeting. So

Who would we say?

Yeah. When So a product? Yeah.

June 15. University of Toronto this afternoon.

I'd I'd have to pull it up. If if we missed that, we could if we if we missed that, we could adjust that. Yeah.

Yeah. And two guys can what? Eight of the photos is where we live out there. I'm 1,500. And we're gonna lose I think with these developments, we're gonna lose the Sand Hill Cranes, Whiteface Ibis that come in. They're in calendar and as well as other things. But, anyway, take a look there. Thank you, Frank. Yeah. It's good to see you.

Anyone else in attendance like to come have a discussion or, I guess, have any comments for the general friend? None? Okay. Thank you. And we do wanna recognize there was a submission by, Kenneth Martin, did submit an email. It's it's quite lengthy. So, typically, if they're short enough, you know, we'll read them publicly. But since there's plenty of people here, I think, here for the next time, we'll spare the time to reading anything. But just just to to wanna add that to record that

Kenneth is submitted. And just for the public is where it is, just like any other public content Exactly. Completely available. Yes. And will it be available? You can toggle up with notes website.

It's pretty well written.

Pretty interesting. So thank you, Kenneth, for some for submitting that. So with that, we'll close, the public comment, hearing for for this item on the agenda when we move forward with the next item, which is discussion and consideration for the recommendation for ordinance twenty six one, adoption of the Nibley City general plan.

Any thoughts, discussion? Do you want me to address Oh, sure. Frank's Frank's question there on Why so he he he he asked, you know, why why why do we have large lots in this area on the East Side and and and smaller lots or even, you know, mix mix the areas on this site. A lot of it, you know, the in the in the general plan, a lot of it is a coordination of transportation and land use. And so part of the reason why in in this area, for example, near near Hollow Road for why we're suggesting and recommending to continue to support large lot residential is because of the limited transportation plan, you know, transportation facilities in that area. So it's one road that goes through there. So it's really kind of limited infrastructure in the area. The other reason is it's in an area on our hazard mitigation. You know, as we've done our hazard mitigation plan and and analyzed it, that it's in an area of high high risk of, you know, wildfire, flooding, different things like that. And so if we put more people in those areas with with greater risk, then, you know, that's that's greater risk of loss of life, loss of property, those kinds of things. And so that that's why in that area, we're continuing to to recommend that. Whereas in other parts of the city, there is all although right now, there may be a limited transportation resource because of it doesn't have the same limited topography. There is, you know, planned additional transportation corridors that can serve those areas and and support the that type of growth. In, you know, resident in residential housing, I would say that's kinda why that that is the way it is.

Joey, you wanna get started with anything and comments, thoughts?

Not right now. Okay. Tyler?

Yeah. Was there any formation with Firebase City on what what their plans are? Are they generally subs on on South Side Of 44 itself.

We did we did have one meeting where we invited different cities to it, and we discussed it. I guess there was one touchpoint. This along the border, there's not a lot of change of what was in the previous plan. We did we did shrink this industrial area just a little bit. It was it was a little bit bigger before, and that was after feedback from our economic consultant just just in the amount of industrial that they thought we could absorb. It it they shrunk it quite a bit at first, and then we got and then we got some feedback from, Bear River Association of Governments, the economic development director, and some of the conversations he's had. He thought there was more potential here, especially with four to 400 south going through. So it shrunk a little bit, not not quite so much. That's a that's a good question. I think we could continue those discussions with Hiram because we did have one touchpoint, but we we didn't engage with them further than that.

What would or is that

stay in the way that some conversations some years ago? Is there any

Yeah. So the county the my understanding is the county is kind of, at this point, taking the lead on 4400 South. Right now, they they got a grant or not a grant. They they got, I believe, COG funds, council government funds to start acquiring right of way for it as well as developing a more detailed design and alignment of the road. They did a they did a feasibility study or a corridor study to to identify more or less where it would go, and that was where it was more wide open. Should it be 4400? Should it be 4000? Should it be somewhere south of 4400? And they said no. They they settled on 4,400, but there's still some questions on the exact alignment and and the exact design of the roadway, the width, and everything. So I I spoke recently with Matt Phillips who who's kind of leading out on this. He's the he's the county engineer and public works director, and they're looking to kick off that study. And then and then shortly after, I I and they and they potentially are already starting discussions with the acquiring right away on that on that corridor.

Then the corridor on 65 Historically, we had we had multiple discussions on his own, but it does not a leave it as residential, but with a almost a commercial overlay. But not flipping the zoning at this point. It's is that still a consideration? Or just are you are we saying that the the consultants recommended that we we don't have an option?

So the consultant is recommending commercial from, you know, 2600 South down just a little bit south of 3200 South as well as the area near 4400 South for supporting commercial. This area in between, they don't they don't show commercial. Like, the consultant just expressed that there's limited comer you know, market for for commercial development. And so and focusing that in in these little bit smaller areas would provide more synergy synergy. This isn't really different from what we currently have in our plan. We don't show we don't show commercial South Of 3200. In fact, this is probably a slight expansion of what's in the current plan. If I go back one slide yeah. I think, like, this area just fell off the 3200.

It's creating a works overlay, so there's not an impact. For still but still making that possibility should

should be those highway properties. Yeah. I think I think that's that's still a possibility. And and if you think that we should, on this future land use map, expand you know, for example, we have on 3200 South these mixed mixed use neighborhood commercial. I think that's the idea there is that you could either have an overlay or just or just the desire, you know, in showing it on the future land use map that if a property owner came forward and they wanted, neighborhood commercial zoning, that this is signaling that the city is supportive of that. We could we could expand that on 165, but that that was just the recommendation to consult is just to compress it a bit between, you know, 2600 and 3200 there. And and as well as once you get South of 4000 South.

Greg?

I don't know. I think

I think, Lee, I answered earlier, but the time do a lot and everything and the reason for that. So and I've seen this a million times.

Sorry. We we keep bringing it back, but there's there's obviously more detail on the plan itself. Can't can't read the whole thing in the public meeting, but if I hope I hope you've had a chance to go through and if you have any comments or anything specific.

You know, one company would have is that it all develops south. You know, three or four lane highway by Section 89. I think there is gonna be a lot more track on on US 89. Sorry. On US 89, we have all of our worst concentrator there, which is fine. But you already have significant conversion notes all the way along, say, nine. So the grocery store in the gas station longer. You got the Willow Intersection at Walmart. And if anything, it's it's actually far more likely that we have long tours available on 165, you know, the East Side of Higher Middle Middle and all that as it develops and then continue to create this linear by mile stretch commercial all along US 21. So so I I do think we want as we adopt something like this, I think we do wanna keep the option open with some sort of personal overlay, something like that on one side. I I feel especially that that little room screw, you see anyone going even this community now have developed something like this stuff like that. They're gonna mob problems of Millville for now January. So people will have a lot more traffic flow going to your city on that major critical road, which based on the main purpose, what's clear and obvious, who is seeing a lot of traffic there. But we already have a meeting. That's that's something I think we should consider going forward, not adjusting this, but making sure there is a provision that that is an option we make that for.

Okay.

Yeah. I will note that, you know, there there's several recommendations in the general plan on updating our zoning. We we intend on hopefully doing a pretty major update to our zoning code in the next year. We I I just submitted an grant application for a technical planning assistance grant, which is the same funding source that helped us with this general plan, to do a a major update of both our our zoning ordinance and, our standard or so our transportation standards and our standards for commercial and institutional development. So cross our fingers that we get that, and it's it's gonna be it's gonna take a lot of hard conversations, I think, to get to get to the point where we need to with that. But we're starting to see some misalignment between what our plans are and what our ordinances are.

Yeah.

Well,

Well, it was it was I'm all the way to to the airport.

You know, those soft build develop. But the major commercial knows we already have in between. It's far more than half industrial, commercial, and fund basis on US Eighty Nine, and you would have more commercial opportunities between higher and Citi right there on the top of the South. I I think I think we we went the obvious path to that for the car there. When you think about future growth, there's been thousands of households in those South builds, and there is no commercial there yet. Is is it gonna fall on the NIMLE side or Iron side? But there's going to be more there. Yeah. Just make sure we keep that out to the open. Yeah. Just to stay the odds or the traffic flow, isn't it?

Yeah. And in this plan, we do show we do show show commercial near twelve hundred west and forty four hundred and then 5200 as well. But with with a lot more industrial in that area. But we might we might as that area grows, look, you know still there. Find find more opportunity. Yeah.

Probably another whole general is not updated. Yeah. Yeah.

But the the

the picture that we made is what does bring the Upwork commerce.

Yeah. Gotcha. Yeah.

I mean, one one thing I appreciate about this process specific to the general plan is it is kind of that comprehensive place that we bring together all the moving parts of our other specific one kind of more general document. All these documents that we're talking about, they are just guiding, you know, high school things. This is really, obviously, set in stone. Right? Plan plans are books. Right? And so the these things tend to evolve over time, and all these decisions eventually become legislative regardless. Right? And so this is a way to for the city to sort of describe,

what our long term vision is. And then, obviously, every legislative decision is case by case in Right. Right. So But it's an important document to make sure that we can hang your hat on it because, really, as we make this particularly as we make zoning decisions and other decisions for for capital development, you know, growth in in the city, we we off we look back to our general plan as kind of a guidepost to to see, hey. Are we are we meeting Mark here? Are we are we a little off off track? Should should we consider, you know, where we were

pushing that we go. And, obviously, it evolves and it changes over time. Yeah. I mean, we get we get when developers come to us and say, we this is on your general plan for this use. Right? Like, we can we get the opposite side of it as well. Yeah.

Anyways. The patient plan, we're updating that.

Yeah. Yeah. Tom's gonna be leading on that one, but I'll I'll I'll be closely involved. We'll bring that back to planning commission as well at that point. But, you know, we recently did an active transportation plan, and we think that'll feed into that that transportation master plan. But it'll it'll give us an Mhmm. Opportunity to take a fresh look as I mean, that that was last updated in, like, 2018.

There's been quite a few changes even since then in our community. So Yeah. I think I think I my only other comment, frankly, is with respect to the residential zoning, I mean, you kind of already mentioned it. The maybe the deviation from the prior plan into a different direction with this one describing in in detail more of the detached and kind of the different levels of residential. It does feel like maybe we need to we need to relook at our residential codes in general and maybe be more deep. Maybe add more of them with different hierarchies, right, or different permitted use not uses, but different how we describe what we want and where with respect to residential zones. And so I would think or I would hope, I guess, that would be kind of the next evolution for what we do here Yeah. To

correspond.

Right. That's it. Yeah. I appreciate you mentioning that. So Yep. Any other thoughts, motions?

Motion? Yeah. Claire?

I make a motion that we accept the general plan. Word. So 26 hyphen zero one

and see it. K. Claire, Megan, you made a motion to recommend the recommendation for ordinance twenty six one adoption of the Nibley City general plan. You need a second? Second by charter. K. Any further thoughts or discussion?

I I just wanna read what said. It does make sense. If 44 actually goes through, the county follows up. A little skeptical on how all the county proceeds.

I mean, there's other parties involved for sure. Yeah. But they So

that's something to be aware of. Mhmm. And I'm sure we can make that as we go. Yeah.

Here's kind of a random question we'd like. If this somehow extremely misses with counsel and they deny adoption of the plan, where does that leave us? Do are we just out of money and just having to start a new

Yeah. Well yeah. I mean, I guess if they deny it, then they we we I think we take further direction from the council of, well, do we need to go back and redo the process? Do we need we would ask follow-up questions to see where to go from there. What what about,

obviously, outright the normal versus just, like, minor tweaks in the future of things like that. Like, I'm I'm interested to see, given the nature and the climate rates, certain things like traffic calming as an example. Right? Like, if they if they were to just wanna speak some language, does it have to come back to I mean, we would still have our recommendation and the planning commission level books. Anything they tweak, does that now reinstigate any any difference in making maybe we wouldn't recommend that based on what they want. You know what I mean? Like, how does that work Yeah. They usually. No. I mean, they take your recommendation, and they can run with it, really. Alright. And in short, they can

they've they've taken recommendations from planning commission and gone a completely different direction. If they want if they wanna do that, it's their perspective. Is that kind of what you were thinking when you asked the question? Just

Yeah. Just kind of like

I it's a it's a year long process. I mean, if I get if if it is

Yeah. I hope it doesn't happen, but it happens. Exactly. It happens. Right? Yeah. I mean, at the end of the day, if it's denied, then it's our currently adopted general plan. You know? That's that's what we that's what we go with. But my guess is if if if they did do that, they would give us some direction on how to get to the finish line.

Yeah.

I think they'd be reasonable.

K.

Any other thoughts? Ready to go to vote? K. We have a motion to recommend,

ordinance twenty six one adoption of the city general plan seconded. I'm going to favor. No post. Thank you. Alright. We'll head to the next item on the agenda. Thank you for being patient with us, which is a public hearing for ordinance twenty six two, amending the Nibley City active transportation plan, removing the trail adjacent to the Scott Farms subdivision. Before we get to, anyone who'd like to approach and provide for a public comment, we'll just have the, like, describe

the the ad for us. Yeah. So I'm gonna I'm gonna give a a brief summary and description and and staff's recommendation. I I will I will say the applicant is here, so I I I do suggest that you also give the applicant time to to explain theirs their proposal in more detail. I've they they did provide a justification, and it's in the packet. But but they're also here present if you if you wanna invite them up to to do that as well. So with with this with this application, it's being proposed to realign some some trails and the neighborhood byway in the active transportation plan, which just just so everyone's clear, the active transportation plan when when we refer to the trails master plan, we're now referring to this this document. It it it denotes, planned trails as well as well as other facilities that are focused on, movement of of pedestrians, bicyclists, non motorized vehicles. So what what they're proposing is to move in a trail that is east west on the that it's borders Scott Farm subdivision and and move it about 1,300 feet to the south. And then, also realign a a neighborhood byway that's that's on the plan. And by neighborhood byway, this is kind of a new term that that was defined in the after transportation plan. It really is is a a low traffic street that typically they they run parallel potentially to to higher traffic streets that prioritize movement of of non motorized vehicles. So focus on traffic calming and and more on on wayfinding for pedestrians and bicyclists, but it's more of a kind of a shared street than a than a, you know, separated trail. So this is what the applicant has has provided. So as you can see on our the one on the left is our snippet of our existing plan, which shows a a planned trail that connects the Nible Nible Meadows subdivision where there there's currently a the trail is going in with stub to to this this area. And those would continue due east and and would border that that Scott Farm subdivision, which looks just to the south of that. And then that neighborhood byway I'm sorry. It's for some reason on that screen, it's it's coming up a little bit, fuzzy. It's it's difficult to see some of the street alignments, but but that purple so that the what I described before is that green line in that in in that area. That purple line is a planned neighborhood byway. And there the current plan shows an alignment which runs to the south of Scott Farm subdivision. What they they propose to realign that so that it'll aligns with with the existing roadway that that stubs out of this Scott Farm subdivision. The applicant, they they go into more detail in their in their application, but they they they have justified this speaking about alignment with city goals for pedestrian access and connectivity, pointing out that this would improve connectivity of the trail from that starts 1500 West, Ultimately, kind of East West trail all the way to 6 40 West and potential connection east of the train tracks. And then oh, I'm not I didn't really point out where they proposed to put to put the trail. So I'm gonna go back one. Sorry. Before I go into that. So they recommend, you know, rather rather than having that trail run north of Scott Farm Subdivision, So you you can see they they show a trail that would go a little bit to the south and then and then run due east toward kind of the south edge of the Mount Vista Subdivision. That's that's kinda where it would terminate, and it could and they and they describe in in their in the proposal that it could cross the the railroad tracks there and into where that there's a stormwater base in there and then, Mount Vista Subdivision. But so sorry. I didn't I didn't give a wanna go back on on that. So back back to this with the applicant's justification, they they talk about alignment with those city goals and improving that connectivity with potential connections to the train tracks. And then, also noting benefits to existing residents by increasing privacy, locating away from existing residents and more use, and and more more use of the trail, with the better connectivity leading to safety. So staff and and by staff, I I mean, myself as well as our city engineer, our our city manager, and our public works director met and discussed this this proposal, and and this is kinda some of the the things that we came to. So and and just some additional background. So when you look at our our active transportation plan, well, first first is as background trails in in general in, the majority of our trails are are provided in conjunction with development. There at times, we do have capital projects where we we install trails, but, typically, we we as our city grows, that's when trails are are provided. The active transportation plan was adopted about a year ago, and it it first focused on improving community accessibility and connectivity while developing safer, more attractive network for vice bicyclists and pedestrians. The the plan network that that you see, it was focused on connecting neighborhood schools, parks, and other community destinations. The existing plan connection that that is on that is currently on the plan that goes to the north of the Scott Farm subdivision, it would provide a direct connection from Nibley Meadows and the Plan Park to 640 West and then and then from 640 West to points north and south, whether it be the, planned, regional park to the South or to the north and connecting into to to 3200 South. We talked about the, you know, the benefit of a potential crossing across the railroad tracks to improve the connectivity as the as the applicant suggested. It it was expressed by my son on staff that, unfortunately, that railroad crossing is unlikely in the foreseeable future, just just due to restrictions from the railroad. So that's that's just something to consider. Does the I I don't I'm not gonna say that it's, like, completely impossible, but it's it it was just expressed as very unlikely. However, the proposal for the neighborhood byway realignment to the existing roadway stub, it it is more logical than the current alignment. It it does make more sense. It's unlikely that that a road is gonna go, you know, directly adjacent to that Scott Farm subdivision. So it it would it would it would make more sense to align with with that existing road. So staff is in support of of that portion of it, which, you know, to be honest, isn't isn't I I don't think I'm out of line saying that's that's not really the main focus of of the applicant's proposal. It's more of the trail and and and moving the trail to a different location. But but just to say that staff is is in support of of the realignment of the neighborhood byway. So staff's recommendation is to recommend approval of this ordinance, but with the condition that, no amendments to the trail lines be approved while approving the pro proposed amendment to neighborhood by way to connect, 303410 South, which is currently being constructed in Nibley Meadows subdivision to, 3480 South.

K. Great. Thank you, by Levi. Excuse me. We did have one

person sign up for a public comment.

Danny? Yeah. Thank you. Your name and address? Thank you. Sure. Danny Jackson.

Danny Jackson. That's a little loud. 667 West 3430 South. So first of all, I wanna thank each of you on the planning, Bishop, for for caring about Nibley and loving Nibley enough to serve and also thank Levi for his professionalism and being very polite as we work through this. Even, importantly, I wanna make new neighbors and the residents of Nibley City who came tonight to make sure that they were seen and their voices are heard, and then we can come to a collective. So we really have approached it from a standpoint of finding a win win compromise. You know, privacy is a big deal. Everyone in this room purchased lots. Some of it's decades prior to the active transportation plan and the previous rentals plan, and none of us in this room knew that those funds were there until August. So it it would came as a surprise to us. If you're asking, well, why are we coming now when you just approved the added transportation plan in February? It's because we discovered this in August. I do wanna formally reply to the the city staff position, and I've got some information here that I'll leave with you. There's a full write up, kind of some key points, and a PowerPoint presentation, if you guys want some of these. And and I don't think I can bring PowerPoint presentation at all, but I can talk to the screen here. So I wanna address a couple of the positions from the city staff. The first one is we're talking about this pathway right here and about it providing direct connectivity. And then there's two destinations that the staff is saying it provides direct connectivity to. One is the regional park. The other would be thirty 200 South. Now if you live north of this line, 3200 South is not a logical destination through that pathway because you're gonna have to travel south and then travel east and then travel north again in order to get to thirty 200 South. So you can take every home that's north of that position and disregard that that's a direct connection or a destination of the BTU person. The second thing I wanna point out is that if you live in this small section right here, which is 600 feet, like, 450 feet when we are behind the trail with the street, and we're current zoning, and I'm happy to see the zoning staying the same, that would route for nine to 12 houses in the space. So we're talking about direct connectivity for nine to 12 homes. Because anybody who lives below there can go directly to 3200 on the 9th. There's a plan bike lane in that position. Anyone who lives south of that can use the neighborhood button and says 3200 South. So our position is that's an invalid argument that it provides necessary and essential direct connectivity. Does provide connectivity. The question is, is it essential? Is it necessary? Does it mean a rough proportionality test and central nexus to supply that for nine to 12 homes? So that that's one of the points we wanna make. The second point and a couple of other points I'll make here, this trail in here, we know it's difficult to negotiate with the railroad. There's no question about that. But I think it's important to note out that on the same plan, we have future rail trip right here, where the city is planning to eventually acquire that property from the railroad. And when the city owns it, it makes a very logical crossing. And the crossing goes as Steve mentioned, the crossing goes into Nibley City loan property right here. There's a retention base in here. We need the lines of the byway. So, you know, instead of talking about this little

corner

right here sorry. Right here. We're talking about the travel that connects from Main Street

through some byways, through these pathways, all the way to the nearest of the travel. It's a much more effective use of same resources. It's much better positioned, and it is extremely more reliable and better use. Two other things I'd like to raise. One is the issue of privacy. And this group is no stranger to to people feeling like their privacy is being interrupted with trails and through backyards and things. The current plan, this one right here, places this pathway 56 feet behind existing residents' homes. I don't know if that sounds like the router a little bit. I think this room is about 30 feet, So it's less than double the size of this room. A person with twenty forty vision at 56 feet can clearly read a license plate. They can clearly distinguish faces of people. They can very easily look into homes and see what's going on in the homes. So that's a that's a big issue. It's a real issue. 56 feet isn't that far, and twenty forty vision isn't perfect vision. And you can still see into all of those places. So that's a big issue too. The last thing I wanna point out in the back that I gave you, there are citations for several different publications by government organizations and planning guidelines about the density and the proximity of trails, how close they should be together. And it's based on pedestrian flows. It's based on bicycle flows. It's based on traffic. The current plan has an eight foot paved pathway, 140 feet from our forklifts. That's pretty close. That's pretty extreme. That's pretty heavy density. And if you look at the publications given by the NACTO, the AASHTO, the FHWA, and the American Planning Association, the APA. In order to qualify for that kind of density, you would have to be in a municipality of 250,000 people, or you'd have to be right along the main arterial road with heavy traffic, including semi truck traffic, and a speed limit of forty months per hour or higher in order to qualify for that event. There's also another condition that if you have a documented case where you have over 500 Cyprus and over 1,500 pedestrians documented using those pathways, it's also justified to have them that close to you. We don't meet any of those conditions. And in fact, if you follow those planning guidelines, we should put we should separate the pathways by a quarter mile to a half mile density. So by relocating the trail here, we are exactly one quarter mile away. We need the density, the planning, the guidelines, all of those kinds of things that are recommended by government bodies. And it gives the city exactly what they want. It gives the city the connectivity. It gives you the same number of trails and libraries that you have on the plan. It respects the privacy of the residents. It respects their voices, and it gives them an opportunity to actually be seen and be heard. So last thing I wanna say is I understand that this is a recommending body. Right? You're gonna make a recommendation, and you're gonna make it city council and they have the final say. And, really, the recommendation is going to be about the lines on them. Where should the lines on them go? But I've spent hundreds of hours on this, preparing for it, talking to people, spoken over a 150 people. When I submitted the petition, 88 people signed it. I talked to 16 more since then. The most disheartening thing about the whole process is how many times I was told, yeah. I'll sign your petition, but the city won't listen to you. Yeah. Good luck, buddy. Hey. Good on you. Alright. They won't hear you. They won't listen. So I think the most important decision you're making tonight is whether or not Nibley City is the location in the city where we make decisions based on the voice of the people, we, the people, or do we make decisions based on somebody else? I think we've gone with a good faith compromise. We've tried to respect what the city is trying to accomplish. We're not grasping that the city in return respect us in respect of purchase. So thank you. Thank you.

Anyone else wanna approach and say anything?

Speak publicly? I will say so

before we move forward, I will say typically in a public comment period, depending on how many comments we have, we are typically traditionally limited to three minutes per comment. I I appreciate your presentation. So just say, if you put if you put if you put if you put if you put a new plan, then it's it's Just be prepared for that that it's usually about three minutes a a period. But Yeah. And and and they It usually just depends on how many people you And Nick's not I think something a little bit different is he is the applicant, Danny. But I can respect. Yeah. I'm just forewarning you. It just depends you know what I mean? Mhmm. Yeah. Anyways

So what? So

is that in court? Yeah. Recommendation? Or was that like, I don't actually know what the point was. Was that the screen that that recommendation, yeah, it should be amended. Is that what you're saying? No. No. My point staff staff recommendation

is only to adopt half of it. So staff recommendation is to adopt this piece of it and keep this piece of it. And our rebuttal is you should move both of these things for all of the reasons I've seen. Move both south. Move both south. Move both south. Well, this one actually moves north right now. It's going through backyards, and it really should align with the city that or the street that's there, 3480 South. But we're saying all of the reasons that we talked about support real small. Because even even when the city acquires this property and takes the rail trail, keeping the trail here did dead ends. It'll never connect across it because there's homes here. You'd have to purchase a home and knock it down to connect to the East Side of the city. This actually has the foresight to say, hey. It's in the future. And it's not the foreseeable future. Right? We're not buying this railroad tomorrow. Someday, we might. It's on the plan. Then you have a logical connection that gets the East Side of the city and the West Side of the city connected and connects into the Hiram Smith Trail, which is a a big part of the future plan Right. In transportation. So our rebuttal is you should accept the proposal to amend and recommend to the city council that they accept it as well. Okay. My name is John.

85 West, 343 South.

Kind of more on a personal level is I'm a person that doesn't have a 34. It has to be social battery. I enjoy the privacy of my backyard, And this is the general public. Anybody can access right on the border of my backyard now. My whole story is I you mentioned was it Leila? You mentioned in your plan in the residential development and housing while retaining the character and form of established neighborhoods, which we are. I know the one north of this is gonna be new, and I hope you guys will consider that there is existing neighborhoods to the south of that trail.

To me, that's a big deal because I lose a lot of privacy that I really enjoy.

And I feel like the efforts to establish a a functional transportation system that can dodge the efforts there. I think this is a good proposal. I, myself, don't care for the trails, but many people do. And so we're trying to respect that. But I do hope you guys will consider that those of us because everybody's gonna order that northern trails here tonight.

And everybody's in the greens that they don't want. If there's anything we can do to readjust it, that would be great.

Thank you. Thank you.

Thanks. Anyone else like to come and speak in public comment period?

Three,

two, one. Okay. Thank you. So with that, we'll close, this item on the agenda and move on to the next item on the agenda being item number nine, discussion and consideration for ordinance. One six two amending the Nipissippi active transportation plan removing the trail adjacent to the Scott on the subduction. Discussion?

Deepak, can you go back to

the staff recommendation, and can you restate the recommendation?

Yeah. So just, recommend recommend approval of the ordinance, but with the condition that no amendments to the trail alignments be approved while approving the proposed amendment to the neighborhood byway to connect 3410 South to 3480 South. Something that might be helpful is put up an aerial of of this area. Do do would that Sure. Would that be helpful to the commission just to especially on this map where it's really fuzzy so you can tell exactly where we're talking about. Maybe I'll trace it with my cursor, the areas that that we're discussing. So in general, the the current trail master plan so just to orient you, this is I'm trying to get this zoomed in to a level that you can tell. Let's see. Here you go. Right there is good. So this is the Scott Farm Subdivision right here. Maybe I'll take off everyone's name so that we don't have to Yeah. That has any titles. Alright. Unpaid taxes. Probably don't need to know that for this discussion. I don't know why you default that. Yeah. They always so so this is this is the Scott Farm Subdivision. This is namely Meadows Subdivision that's currently being built. The the current trail alignment in well, in the master plan, there there is a trail being built right here in Nibley Farm or sorry. Nibley Meadows that would stub to this property. This this property here is not part of that development nor any of these other ones. But it would basically just continue this directly to the east, with is what's in the current plan. The the neighborhood byway is this, and it shows it it would be connecting this to currently, it shows that the south of the subdivision, what they're proposing is to align it with this 3480. The trail, they propose so there is a trail also within the Nibley, metal subdivision being built, and it'll basically stub at or and and at 900 West here or here. The trail they're proposing would go to the south to, basically, to this property line where this canal alignment is and then head east and with the potential connection in in here to the Mount Vista subdivision. So that's that's what they're proposing. And I will just say this was a this was a pretty tough one for staff. We went back and forth on it. It was kind of a I'll just say it was kind of a democratic decision among the four that were involved, different opinions. We went back and forth on it. There's pros and cons to both approaches. But, ultimately, kind of one one of the things that was pointed out is just the the number of people that are that are going to be served by this trail in in the Nible Meadows subdivision and as as this area grows and the destination of this park here having that direct connection, more or less to the to the planned park was was of value. So that's kind of where where that discussion led. But there's definitely some some pros of the approach of the applicant as well. K. So

the so right now, so

So we get the intersection of 6440 and 3430. So right now, it's on the proper line going east West. Right? Yeah. Right here. That's that's what's in the current

master plan.

Yeah. Yeah.

Right. This one on the current master plan more or less would terminate right here. What's being proposed is that it would continue south on 900 West to along this property line, and then and then head east. Okay. So kinda meander down. Proposed. Yeah. Yeah. Proposed by the applicant. No. So that would be a a neighborhood byway designation, which is basically, just a designation that that you have, like, share a shared lane for bicycles. You have some traffic calming to discourage cut through traffic, but it's just really a neighborhood street that that that's know. Public street that is designed for to slow traffic down, basically.

Overall?

Street. And just

Mhmm.

Got the

the the the. Are you Michelle's norm of between

the northern end of 3430 and

No. No. There's not. I mean blocks

are 3,202.

I mean, it's a it's Cuddle blocks. So here's 3,200. Proposed trail is about, I mean, 3,400, basically. It's about a quarter mile. I mean, cutting off access, I I I I wouldn't I don't know if I would go so far to saying four eighty.

Yeah. There there's

nothing.

Right. Yeah. Yeah. I think I I think the re you know, staff's recommendation is, yeah, having that direct connection into the park. People from the north the the south could or north or south could get to that would provide some value. I wouldn't necessarily say that you're cutting people off, especially if we develop a connected street network. There there there should be ways that they could get into the park other than that trail, presumably, you know, if we if we if we develop a, connected street network through there, and it's not just like an island of At all. Old aesthetics. That's the neighborhood, by the way. Yeah. So the purple is neighborhood.

I can answer that. Yeah. So the the fuzzy line, I did that on purpose because that's our proposal. I'm trying to differentiate between the active transportation

plan as a.

And and that road's already it's already I'm sorry. We got two roads down. The road is in exist. Yeah. But we we show we show neighborhood byways on our plan as but, you know, that we we could potentially do additional treatments to calm traffic even if it's an whether it's an existing road or as we build new roads. You know, neigh neighborhood byways, the idea there is it's it's a street that will connect you, but it's not on a main road like 3200 South or 2600 South. So oftentimes, you wanna do traffic calming and ways to divert traffic because if it if it's a continuous street that actually connects more than just a few blocks, then you're a lot you're often gonna get cut through traffic. Right? You're gonna get people that are gonna wanna take that that way and and use it as kind of a collector road, and it's it's really not supposed to function as a collector. It's supposed to, it's it's supposed to be a a quiet street, for people that could walk or bike on.

640 West. I think, well, I don't know. Is that

It is. Yeah. People on the phone? It is. And it's there's a couple facilities proposed for 640 West. I think a bike lane as well as a trail. And the trail could run along the railroad tracks as as the applicant mentioned. I don't I mean, we haven't done a feasibility analysis of of exactly how much space on different roads, but that that's the overall master plan. But you could potentially, you know, on the side of 6 on the right of way of 640 West, have a have a roadside trail as well.

Can I ask for some context here? We mentioned something happened in August. I want I wonder can we expand upon how we got to this point? I mean, we can't just make people put in a trail unless there's a subdivision or some sort of change in use. Can we collaborate just for some context? Yeah. Can I comment on that? Sure. Okay.

Yeah. So the reason it became apparent in August is I submitted a concept map to subdivide five acres of property that's directly to the North South from sub division to subdivide it in three lots. And so I applied for the minor subdivision application. I sent that into Levi with the concept map, and that's when we found out that we didn't qualify for a minor subdivision because of

this plan to have the pathway on the active transportation plan.

The plan also includes a flag lot, which would disqualify it from minor subdivision as well. But, really, what we're we're talking about, the subdivision five acres into three parcels including flag lot. So it kind of the flag lot land blocks all of that

as well.

So we're we're talking about exacting property from a long time owner and all of the the things that came along with that over a three loan subdivision.

Great.

I'm sorry. The public comment period. I apologize. Yeah. Was that sure. Yeah. Just just a personal context. Yep.

Thanks.

When you're talking, it looks like he has.

I have the room here. So you know what?

Sage's recommendation.

I'll pull I'll pull up the proposal again. So this is this is the existing plan. The staff's recommendation is to leave that on the on the map. Sorry. I will you can't see the whole thing, so let me get this on here. Actually, that doesn't help because then you can't see my cursor. Yeah. The laser's somewhere in here, but I don't know I don't know if it's up there. So so, yeah, this is this is what's on the plan. This is what staff's recommending that it be left. Again, this is a legislative decision. You have you have the leeway on this, but that's staff's recommendation. But but the right side, this is what's proposed for of the the applicant, and that's to realign the trail to the to the south and basically go there's there's a property between Scott's farm Scott Farm Subdivision and and where this would go. It's about one city. You know, typical city blocks, about 600 feet or so south of Scott Farm about 1,300 feet south of the existing alignment, it would it would go down here, and it would align with there's a a stormwater basin across the railroad tracks on the south end of of Mount Vista Subdivision. So that that's what they are proposing. So rather than having this trail and this trail and then realign this the neighborhood byway, which staff is in support of that because, to be honest, it probably should've been away in the first place. Yeah.

Yeah. Okay.

That's all the range out in sales and division is fonts. Correct.

Yep.

And in most situations, the trial will be built by the future developer.

Correct. Yeah. And the specifics of that get kinda fleshed out through the subdivision process. I will I will just say that that our code does say if you subdivide, you build the master plan trail. There is there is a path forward if they wanna dispute that. But but in general, we've we've found that at least the ombudsman office has has backed us up with any any that we've dealt with with requiring those trails. So I'll just say that, like, if this stays on the master plan, it doesn't necessarily mean, like, they have to build this tomorrow. It's it's in conjunction with that development process and and review. But but it but it would be, you know, stay on the map if if that if that's us. City council approves this.

Sure.

I'm just

I don't really understand that. The bill that it runs up with, that's where the copy that in turn my note would help it would cut off when it comes to the copy of the order. So where is how do you find the balance as far as cutting off future building around the use and current private property, someone not at the end of the pretense is the biggest use.

Good question. I mean, I so you're so the the question is essentially, when we make these plans, why do we make people build trails when we have from people who own property for a long time, basically, David?

On the other hand, you're kind of here's gonna be private probably if there's permission for that or understanding how it works.

Yeah. So so this is just land use plan. That that's what this is about. It is just like future development of the city. You can see all the signs around the parts of that stuff. This is what it is. No one's building this trail right now. What we're saying is when someone does develop it, if they want to build and put houses in place and all those in place, you also have to build the trail. So regardless of what we say now, if the homeowner comes in and actually build the houses, nothing's gonna. So us saying that there will be a trail here eventually doesn't doesn't give up any private property. No one has the right to end on getting this property. That's not a that's not a really speech at all. And even if we say it is today, like, if like, you still you don't have rights to it until it becomes part of the. So so no one's renders any private property rights by any decision we made tonight. What we're doing is saying, what's gonna be the shape of human activity? Now you get one neighborhood to another neighborhood when and if that ever turns into something.

And, usually, during the subdivision process, the ownership of that property goes from, like, a someone who who farms the property or owns it for a long time, as you mentioned. And then, typically, the the person that owns that properly traditionally doesn't have the means to then develop and, you know, provide all the upfront financials to build homes and all that stuff. So some a developer would then might not be and that vision is passed on to the developer. It's no different than Vootser. Right? Did that answer your question, hopefully?

I think

I mean, this this meeting is not the right we're kind of in a meeting.

And that will, for sure, exist to what I would more ask you is what you are saying as part of this. Going through the land over complication, the actuality of this happening and the fact that it would cut into private property that is not within the forest.

Yeah. Yeah. The the only way any of our roads are built or our our trails are built are typically, we exact them, meaning someone develops the property, they build homes, and we say, okay. We have a master plan for a trail here, so you have to incorporate this trail, as part of your development. Or another option would be that we purchase the property, and we build the trail. That's something we rarely do. But but those are kind of the two two options of developing the trail. If it doesn't develop and no one wants to give or us buy the property, there won't be a trail there.

Right. Yep.

Or would it take a long time to raise it badly

Yeah. That been through the sub infusion process. That's why we're here. Mhmm. Okay. Let's we're we're gonna try to bring this back in and keep this more of a formal the formal meeting that it is. I we appreciate the comments and the questions. It's always good to discuss and educate and yes. Okay. So we'll get back to the discussion amongst the permission. Does anyone have any other thoughts?

So the proposal request is to shift the trail, lead the road with the best location. The reason the shift to trail is because it doesn't connect to any other trend except for the railroad track. Is there anybody on the channel? We both can answer the CIS. Yeah. I'll pull it back up. So I figured this one. Yes. Yep.

Maybe point to where the proposed new green

I think I've got the figure now.

Sorry. It's good it's good to know what we're no. It's the north edge. The north edge

right here. Yeah. Which goes right where the components

So all of these panels would flow in here. They wouldn't walk about to go here, then they move over to the East West. There are no East West intersection of here in no close to the. So if we put a shell there, people are still coming down from here or coming down from the capacity. And I do think this is a recall proposal because this is more of a a line of connectivity in the East West flow than coming down here, going down, and then going there. I mean, it feels more like a a Mhmm. I do agree. We don't want I like big, long phones, probably not a bunch of 90 degrees.

And I think, you know, it is important to to mention. So I live in Mount Vista myself. And I think when we talk about infrastructure like this, I think there's an important balance, you know, just have to consider of, you know, anyone, including myself, right, when we move to an area like that with the with planning trails and place, we kind of already know that going into it. Right? So we get to make that decision as to whether that a trail like that makes sense for us as we buy property and they were this is a very, you know, often difficult situation where the city makes a plan. Again, these this is why we call it a plan. Right? And and and it just happens to correspond with a preexisting neighborhood that's been out there a long time. And, ultimately, this is why these meetings and this mechanism exists is to get public input, debate as a commission, then make our recommendation right and then into the to the council. So these meetings are important. I I I hope, you know, we all feel good about this discussion and everything. But but, ultimately, for me, we still have what we want, which is a trail. And and, Tyler, to to to to what you said, I mean, I live in Memphis. I live right there by the detention area. We still basically get what we what we want us to connect one neighborhood to another to then get to a park. You're not gonna be able to cross over anyone's private property to the West of Mount Vista going north all all the way to the to 3200 anyways. And so to me, it's like we're already getting what we want anyways, which is a trail. If we move it another 600 feet to the south We should go in somewhere. Yeah.

And and and, yeah, I know. It doesn't change any of the responsibility of the property owner because whoever owns that parcel is gonna have to put on the north side of parcel in the south. So I don't see any impact to the residential to the future land use or property owners. But kind of to your point, the people who bought those homes didn't know that's what's gonna be there and how it is. So I'm gonna be in agreement. Let's move it further south, and the people who buy the homes are trying to lose some future homes because they're making make that. Okay. Okay. Shaniqua, do you guys will hate me then.

Alright. Any other discussion amongst the the commission or anyone want the recommendation?

Recommendation.

My recommendation to

approve ordinance or approve recommendation of ordinance three six zero two with the adjustment of the neighborhood byway from about 3,500 to realign it in case 3480 South. And for the realignment of the Sheryl from about 3400 South to 3600 South.

Okay? I mean, I'm not sure I'm gonna be able to repeat that. Second. Okay. Do we have any other discussion? Okay. I'm doing my best to restate the motion. Probably mess this up. We have a recommendation from the planning commission for ordinance twenty six two amending Nibley City active transportation plan removing, gosh, the trail adjacent to Scott Farm subdivision, aligning the public or the neighborhood

what do we call it?

Byway, to basically align to 3480 South and then to move the trail south to basically align to 3600 South. Seconded by the top. Any other discussion? K. Go to vote. All in favor?

Right. We can post. Thank you. Alright.

Next, which is a workshop for of OpenSpace with. Are you back?

Yeah. I introduced this at the last meeting.

Let me

and just for the applicant, I'll follow-up. The the next city council meeting is on January 8, so it'll be on the agenda for for city council at that time. January 8. January 8. Yep. At 06:30. Yep. Hopefully, I didn't get that date wrong. Is that right? Yeah. Okay. I've done that before. Okay. So this this really is really, really simple question, clarification, and this is whether so we we we just adopted the city just adopted this option to pay a fee in lieu of open space required amenities and open space, but really to today, just focus on open space. The question is the way it's written in current code is that you can only pay a fee in lieu of open space If you provide less open space, then then is then is required. So, like, let's say it's required to have 35% open space and you wanna and and you and that's round numbers. That's 35 acres and you only wanna provide 30. Well, you could pay a fee in lieu of those five acres and then put put homes on those five acres at the density that's allowed under under that zoning. The question came up, from a developer. What if they're already providing the amount of required open space within the development, but they have leftover open space that they could add additional density to? So let's say let's say what If you can that. Yeah. So I'll just I'll just using that same example, let's say 35 acres is required, and they they're giving 35 acres, but they have additional acreage that they're meeting the the density thresholds on on the remaining that they could potentially put additional additional housing on. Could they pay a fee in lieu of that? Even though they're they're giving us the open space, a a set in effect, they're paying for additional density while still providing the open space. Would that be allowed? Oh, so if

let's say, 800.

Post. Mhmm. And they got extra. So they they'll let me factor the amounts of density they got, not. Yeah. And so can we go in excess of Yeah.

So that's four accurate. They wanna use those extra five acres for it because they maxed out.

So the question is and it's and it's just on the agenda as a workshop. Do we wanna amend the code in some way to say You convince you to go.

Because that's the only situation in which we're gonna have a limit on. Almost been. A little bit of.

Yeah. Yeah. That's a good point. That that's the only one. Okay. I can see that.

Yeah. You're the the where was the condition? Did you get the bonus kicker if you got a PDR?

Yeah. It's another option. I don't I I don't

That's what

I yeah. That that that that's just the question that came up. There there there was a

So it does accomplish data.

Yeah. So I guess just question among the commission. Do do you think that's something we should pursue or just leave it as is?

Can you make a video situation where

the density will be capped with extra acres?

Well, the this came up from an example from from a potential developer. They just they could fit, for example and and they don't have the zoning, but they're they're they're looking at an RM zone. Right? They could get, 10 acres or 10 units to the acre. They can fit those 10 units to the acre on less land and still provide the open space and have some leftover open space leftover is what they've expressed at least on their on their concept plan that they provided. They they they could fit all that in. And on that leftover acreage, rather than just giving it as no open space or more, I guess, bigger yards for people, they would rather put put additional units there, pay a few fee in lieu of open space to the city, and then and then Yeah. It would increase their it would increase their density.

Yeah.

As long as we go to that, it's if the the setback is required to setback with easements and all that are now calculated to open space, that's the that's what we learned here on the the the originally parts of the missions. Like, if we're calculating that in the arm zone, now we're not really using open space. We're using existing set asides for easements. But I would yeah. I I don't know if that would

They just have additional space. So the RM I I You mean, like, how are we getting to where there's The RM zone the RM zone allows for

a bigger variety of housing types Yeah. Than the RPD does. So you could get smaller units packed in, you know, packed into a a tighter space k. And then still have and still have

space left over. And, essentially, circumvent.

Potentially. But, I mean, in this specific example, they just they wanna build townhomes. Right? And we within our current within the RM zone currently, we don't actually require different housing types. We just limit the size of the development. Yeah. I don't think that's in no. Good. I don't think so. We discussed it. We we went back and forth on it, but, ultimately, we shrunk the the maximum size of an of an RM zone. And, basically, you said if you're gonna go bigger That's right. We'll we'll point you we'll point you toward our PED. So

It's more based around now I'm gonna develop. It's usable or not usable versus impact needs to build out. Yeah.

Which, in practice, probably what they would do yeah. Yeah, maybe they would give more open space. But if they had some single family homes in there, they would probably just make those lots larger. Right? Because they'd make more money off of that than just having Yeah. Than just having green space. But, hypothetically, they could if they could fit more and still if they could still provide the open space, like, basically, this just becomes a way to buy So to me additional way and see. That. It's open to your question.

Do do you walk if they have access, then they should probably ask them the question to go back to the drawing board, be more creative in your housing variability. Right? And and because naturally, they're just gonna say, well, instead of just providing that open space, and it's gonna be common area or whatever to make more money, right, they just say, hey. Let's just make some of these larger lots and blah blah blah. Yeah. Versus just increase them and then say fee in lieu and then what Mhmm. So what would we want, I guess? Right?

But then it also depends if that section is a receiving zone.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean Yeah. To me, it's just another option. Yeah. Every everything we add to this, we add TDR. We add open space. We you you can make the argument that it undermines the other one because people are gonna have these options, but it just becomes another

stuff.

But the field would be

the field would be an option that

explain your fee for big reason. That That's in there that's in there already. Yeah. I think it's a half a mile.

See. It's gonna be a contradiction of something. If you can pay me money, I'll let you go more.

That's a good question. I think I think we need a proposal. We we we haven't we haven't talked to our attorney.

Yeah. Feel like we we don't have any bigger. Mhmm.

It's a little weird. Feels a little It feels a little It it does it it is cleaner if we can say, this is our requirement. You wanna go be below that requirement, then then there's this fee in lieu, and it and it provides this benefit. But because, really, what's the ceiling? Right? Is there like, I feel like if we go above, maybe maybe there's gotta be some ceiling.

You see how the developer

it's a whole building 25 acres. But

I can give you the open space and maximum density out on 20 acres. Why not? Just developing a few. 20 acres. 20 acres are different. Yes. Mhmm. And I think what you what we're doing is that there's a there's a map of the whole of the space.

It's it's Is it with the same

Yeah. It is at the same density. You're right. So it'd be 10 units per net develop per acre. So, like, let if they only have five acres or if they have one acre let's say they have one acre, they can build 10 more homes on it. There's a cap. I guess that's the cap.

Works a little bit more expensive because then that that's the one that won't be developed.

I I shrugged my shoulders when they asked, so that's why I brought it I wanted to bring it up.

Give me your I don't

if you have a They showed me they showed me a concept plan, and they said, k. Here. We can put the 35% here. We can do go That meets our code? That meets our code. Yeah. 10 units to the acre here. We we still have this leftover space. How many acres was left over? I don't know. I know. I can't remember.

But

But they still had land left over above the 35%.

You mean split

it? Yeah. I don't know.

Well

They would still have a portion of that remainder distributed

between two parts, then then it would basically be able to make two. Because if you you're still looking at percentage. Yeah. So The the best guess is it's 35 30 let's say it. 30 acres is 30%. We gotta have 10 acre of local space.

If I have a 35 acre parcel and I got five acres remainder, would that also change the amount? Because now you you gotta do 35% of the full. I'd love to see that. I don't understand.

It's a little it's a little goofy. I agree. Is it is this is odd looking figured parcel? Is that why? No. It's a rectangle. The rectangle.

No. That if you have five extra acres, that if they're if you can move to develop those five extra acres, now they have to do 30% of that is what we're saying. What could this so far that we're in?

So so so yeah. Would that say in multiple for that extra five acres?

No. No. So so you would You're it's gonna be 5% of the entire development. Right? They already have the 35% of the entire development, and the extra five acres or how much acres is all developed. It's Yeah. So why aren't they just doing it?

Because they already maxed that out. Oh, and Yeah. They already got they already got 10 units per net developed per acre, and they still have land left over that they could because they maxed it out, the only way Wait a second.

Wouldn't that okay. Isn't is that how would they have access? Because that's already baked into the how does to the numbers that in terms of what their net development So with the density. So

Am I saying that? Well,

so this city only tells you how many units an acre. It doesn't tell you, like, especially if you have 30 buyers, you can ask for 30 acres. Like but when you have we don't stay how big the footprint of a townhome has to be. That's true. Yeah. So yeah. And then You're right. Yeah. That's true.

And if they they could see that Right. It it comes down to what's considered open space is the common area parking lot and drive

open space. So it covers that And I and I didn't get into that with this specific developer, but that is laid out in in our ordinance, what you count, what you don't count, and we would check on that. Like, they they might not have

I I figured it out. Continue discussion.

Everyone's thinking. Like, like, what is being the open space that we are? Because I I haven't we haven't I haven't seen that one enough. No.

Well, the RN still we don't really build that two places. Right?

No. So I guess that's another maybe that's another that's a that's a that's a that's a tangential that's a tangential discussion from this. But within the RM zone, we put a provision in there that you can only do it in the town center area. If on on the future line of Smith, it says it's town center or high density residential. If the city council adopts the general plan, our designations are all different. So we'd probably have to go back and change that anyway because the on the on the current general plan, we don't have either one of those designations, or it just wouldn't be allowed anywhere.

Please. Don't get anywhere. Okay. Or

because there's there's nothing called high density residential on there. So I think we we would have to amend if we wanted RM to be allowed, we'd have to amend the ordinance and designate whether it was mixed residential, what or or attached, those those different designations that we put on there.

Same question. Like, like, like, like, for some

mixed types of policy and economic basis. I don't want track roadhouses.

And we could bring up the broader RM zone. Really, this was this is a very pointed question of whether we're okay with, like, allowing additional additional homes to be built if if they're still providing the open space or if we're we're only allowing that if they go below the open space requirement. Just that just like, two or this any This is any zone. This isn't, yeah, this isn't just RM. You're right. This is this is Keep in mind.

Because I think we have look. We're required to get the density we got. I wanna say that's true.

Pretty close, actually. You you But we still have Barely. Barely. More than what we were A little bit, but not much because your HOA president came to us and asked if he could sell a property. And I said no because it was it's like, if you take that away, you don't meet Yeah. That that threshold.

We're we're we're we're we're.

Not anymore. Maybe I shouldn't have disclosed that, but but I'm just saying, like, it's actually pretty tight. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

But this is also. Right? Like, Carly, especially with

with the general plan is if this passes, this is going to require probably a very big overhaul on our current zoning, like, this doesn't have the recommendation general plan. So as we're in as we would introduce all these potential zoning changes,

this applies. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I guess, in in the end, it's it comes down to this would then require what a development at at this point? Or or I guess Not necessarily because this start open.

This applies if it it's our PUD, then it's in a development agreement. If it's RM, not necessarily. If it's say? We I guess that's a

negotiation? Well, that's

It

depends. It's an op is it but is it an an entitlement, or is it an option for negotiation?

Or are we trying to decide that? The way it's written in there is it's it's just allowed. You could just pay the fee. So we're still trying to determine what that fee should be, actually.

That's another discussion. But says if there's anything access they can

access to If they wanna go below the threshold and put homes there at the same density as as the zoning allows in that in that open space, they can pay a fee in lieu, and it goes toward parks parks and recreation to the city. So Yeah. It Yeah. That's in code now. If they're if they're within if they're half a mile if they're more than half a mile from a park, then they have that all. No. If they're within half a mile of park, that is yeah. Then that's allowed.

Right now. Right now. I mean, I I would

Sorry. It's yeah. This is hard to

Where is again, this is the. Yeah. I I understand how they can Yeah. It's only a it's not a problem. It is just yeah.

So you're in our end right now, I'm sorry. What you're saying?

No. Or any or any zone. Any zone, you can do that, but you couldn't you can only offset the required open space. You can't go you can't say, okay. Hypothetically, I could do more open space, so I'm gonna buy additional densities above that. Right? Yeah. Because if you if you So right now, there there's really kind of it raises that cap a bit. There's still a cap because it's based on whatever whatever the the zoning allows. If it's if it's in our if it's a open space subdivision, it's they still have the cap of the whatever density

they would be at, above, you know, the underlying zone. Personally, I'm just I mean, when it comes to situations like this, it's just me personally, anytime I mean, we have these ordinances and codes in place, essentially, effectively to describe to the public what the maximum density for development could be. Right? Mhmm. And anytime extra step could happen that totally contradicts what the zone described, and it's just entitled without any negotiation. I don't like that at all. Yeah. And miss

But because now that we so yeah. Did you think about where we're talking about the waterways, the boundaries flow, ultimately, we got a web lens, we got a classical flow, we got the setbacks. Like, you have you have a land that cannot even help. It's gonna be all. We make it end up getting a whole bunch of extra housing stock for someone that's gonna remain involved in Regardless. Regardless.

Is there a much discussion in staff on these different ideas or around TDR with this? Like, is there, like, a preference? Or

I mean, the fee in lieu is easier Yeah. The hypothetically than TDR. It's it's not it yeah. It's it's a lot cleaner and easier if we adopt a fee. I don't I don't know if it's better. It's hard because we have we don't really have any real world examples here. Right? Yeah. It's all hypothetical. So this. Yeah.

Yeah. And it's Is there a anything in code that describes Mhmm. It's kinda I'm I'm trying to ask this question to the ones that kind of our tech fees work. When we get a if if we were to get it being moved, this can it go to maintenance? Can does it have to go to new

facilities? Like It's pretty wide open. It just says Okay. The way it's the way it's written in code is it just needs to go toward parks and recreation facilities. It could be spent

at our discretion. Yeah. Is that right? Six years

is what state code requires, that it must be expended within six years.

That's good to know that. When have we ever gotten a fee in lieu report before?

No. This is new. This is brand new to code. Yeah.

This works.

Yeah. We we talked about that and and and the improvement of

of the part.

Yeah. But So your question is, you know, you're gonna need to understand the date. Probably. And so what we want if we want to build on the power benefit, it should pay for.

So are you saying that it flexes depending on that fair market value? So we don't necessarily define it, but but but we just look at fair market value.

$450,000 in fees, we have to build it.

Would we could we report an appraisal?

Yeah. Should.

That's different. That makes my job a little easier now. I'm trying to pin down a specific number. I'm I'm struggling with it. It it depends. Yeah. We we talked fair market value, though, but also what it would cost to improve that, you know, with Well, so

less than the beer. Excuse me. Basil. Mhmm. Just, you know, make it very successful.

Okay.

Alright.

Well, I'm kind of hearing that there's not a lot of appetite to do anything with this. Well, I'm I'm Okay. Is it worth it is the question.

I think we should

just see can we actually

go above Yeah. Upper density if you pass it. Yeah. I'll I'll ask I'll ask our attorney to see if that's Yeah. If that's even legal.

Maybe it's something we just hate. Like, if, again, going back to the general plan, if there's gonna be potential a lot of changes, like, this might only be valid for a very short time. And then

Yeah. We might need to revisit in general as part of that exercise, and then and then we set up a more solid framework at that time. That's a good point. I I maybe eight was, like, a year.

Figure out this will be and then come back to the

I do have a couple of general plan. It's flaw it's flipped of what we actually say we're gonna do. We're supposed to layer the valve from industrial commercial, mixed use residential high density residential meeting. So what you have is right on January, you've got high density high residential density, then you have detached residential, then you have a commercial, and then you have industrial. So the way the city plan has been set before is you're in Buffalo townhomes and stuff like that into the detached neighborhoods. But that's that's not how the general public service.

This sign right? Mhmm. Yeah. Going down the porting porting. It's a little it's a little different in certain areas, and I and and part of it had to do with some feedback we got trying to balance what we heard from the public and some feedback we got from some steering committee members on we had an iteration that had more of that, more more mixed and and higher density residential in those areas. And they said, we we need more detached residential areas. So some of those flip toward detached. Yeah. That it was it was a tough balance, and it's hard to lay it all out. Right? But that that's that's how that kind of panned out.

Yeah. Okay.

It's like transportation plan. Yeah. And I have to swallow.

Yeah. It's like the adopted, obviously, until ten years.

And then, you know,

Yeah. I think it's a it's a good exercise to get the community involved in you know, we got a real a lot of really interesting comments even from the open house, right, of, like, lots of support. Ask a lot of tax questions. Yeah. Did you understand

city stuff work? So, you know, I mean Yeah. So Okay.

This is your lot. We had a discussion. Thank you.

So I I guess the consensus is to

either table for maybe if it's possible to get an example or even just table to see what flushes out in general. Is that fair to say? What do you mean? The

Yeah. I mean and this is a workshop. So I I don't feel like this is with everything that's going on and everything we're trying to tackle, that this very specific issue, like, I don't know if it's worth our time to try to flush this out before we even have one example of of someone trying to use the fee in lieu. Like, we don't even know if it's viable. Yeah. No.

Just get involved in some work today. No. Something. No.

Yeah. Yeah. I see what you're saying, but no. No. This they're stuck with us. Yeah. On this one, for sure.

Maybe the first guy that

it would be a, and then we see how it works, and then we caught up I a. Yeah. If and and and this particular applicant, they really they they really don't want to do a development agreement. They want to just make it work with whatever's in our code. And so that's Oh, we got code. There it is. Deal with it. Yeah. And they've so, anyway

K. Alright. Well, we I guess the consensus is table this one for future discussion. Yeah. The motion doesn't need Nope. To that. It's just a Yeah. Just a workshop. So, k, we'll move to the laptop and on the agenda, which is staff report next time.

I don't think I have anything new other than to say, as you might know, we're gonna have a a lot of new planning commissioners.

Who's coming to me? We

don't we don't know yet. Larry's Larry's working on it. So so next meeting's gonna be a lot different. And I think that the chair because we've had we've had discussed this in the past. Sometimes the the planning commission gets involved in the chair discussion. I think, yeah, ultimately, the mayor with the council's approval will appoint the chair. So there'll be a new chair. There'll be a new three new planning commissioners likely. Two or three. I don't I don't know. But I should I won't spread any rumors or anything. So so, yeah, look forward to next year. Maybe get thinking about what we wanna accomplish in the next year, but I know we've already started to discuss some big things that we're trying to do. But I think that's probably something we'll put on the next agendas, just our goals for next year if we if we don't have a super full agenda, which I don't necessarily foresee. So, Alan, you think that's it? Yeah. The

The city council passes their annual schedule by resolution. The planning commission is not clearly. So with the approved and passed resolution with city council, when we last brought out that schedule here to the planning commission Oh. One of the dates for the planning commission also of the city council. So talking with, staff, we decided to move the proposed date from the tenth to the seventeenth to the next Is that July? December. December.

Oh. December 2026. Just in case you're planning that Yeah. Year. A year from today. It's pretty good to me, but we wanted to make that a note down.

I outside on the the posting. It's not the tenth, and that's because the city council have a meeting that night. So Ten to seventeen.

Yeah. Ten to the seventeenth I just put I put the wrong date on the board. So Now the planning commission,

it's just required to have one meeting per month, and it can also be amended by numbers. So it's not really a big deal for right now. But when we get a little closer, if that date doesn't work, then that can be discussed.

Look, Ted, I don't see any market conditions to expedite additional developments requiring one one one. Yes. We

were kind of sold this year. We're do yeah. We do we have them scheduled every every three weeks, but just to fall in line with city council's cadence as well there. But, oftentimes, it's four or five weeks because there's a holiday or there's you know? On on it, I think we have, what, 14 meetings over the course of the year, something like that, but

that's where we're at. Our main adjustments are with Heritage Days, Pioneer Day,

and of July. Yeah. Fourth of July. Yep. We have the breaks, spring break, and Yep. Different you you tell, like, the cities and towns. There's several conflicts that we steer away from, and so

yeah. Alright. I'm gonna take my last opportunity as chairman and just I just wanna thank you all so much. Wish I was here too. Doing so much over two years. Just couldn't thank you all for not for help educating me. It's part of the process.

And let the corporate said it continued.

So just wanna thank you all. I really appreciate it. And with that, I'll sit I'll tell this meeting adjourn. Thank you.

Appreciate it. I know. Don't you believe that? I hear you. About that.