Nibley City Council- 5/7/26

Before we start the meeting, Randy Scully, do you get any inquiries?

I dialed that with the button. Thank you, man. I was

recently rereading the Washington's terrible address. It's 15 pages, and I think it's nice to be connected on occasion to founding fathers and what they had to say. As I read it, there was one thought that I've highlighted in my copy for tonight, and it's this quote. In reviewing the instance of my administration, I'm unconscious of the intentional error. I am nevertheless too sensible of my defects not to make it probable that I may have committed many errors. Whatever they may be, inadvertent beseech the almighty to avert or mitigate the evils to which they may intend for Washington, 09/19/1786. I thought about that in noting that we're on the city council for a four year experience, us here, maybe longer. And I suppose there's many errors that we make, and yet the intent is never to make a mistake or to have error. And so I'm just grateful for to be on the council, and I'm grateful for the people I I work with and to know that our intention is always

serve the people of Nivoli to the best of our abilities.

Thank you, man. K.

Let's admit you're here. If you'll start on that, please.

You're a man. You know? Yeah. You sound good? Very man. You sound good.

Are we in different suits tonight?

Yes. Okay. You guys try to control yourself. Larry Jacobson, staff.

Levi Robert, t planner.

Jonathan. Tom, the engineer.

They're on the.

And, Talon, you're gonna you're on the agenda. Steve, do you wanna identify or so you're gonna give us a little report probably? Yeah. And, chat

Both?

Both? Both? Chat. Thank you. This is what happens when you're in front of a microphone. Chat, are you gonna give us a little okay. We'll let you do some better terms. I also ask you to take a look at March 5 minutes and April 9 minutes, and let's just deal with those two things first.

Thoughts,

motions. Motion from people. Motion from Nick. Second from from Nathan to approve full sets of minutes. Discussion on that motion, please? Seeing none, those in favor, please say aye. Wait. Any opposed? K. Motion passes unanimously. And then we have agenda proposed for you. I'll take a motion on that to accept that agenda, please. Should you agree, agenda? Motion from second from Garrett. Thank you very much. Any discussion? Cool. Those in favor, please say aye. Any opposed? Unanimous. Thanks very much. Okay. We're at a oh, I thought he was gonna stand up. That's all. We're at a we're at a place where, in our agenda where anyone is invited to stand up and address the council on anything related to Nibley City governments. I see some some faces I recognize tonight, and I thank you for coming out to our meeting. I I hope to help us set the expectation tonight. There is an annexation petition on our agenda tonight, and I wanna be clear that the action before the council to discuss is whether to begin the process, accept a petition of evxation, which would then do things like start official protest periods to entitled entities, get the county involved, and a number of other things. And it typically takes about thirty days to, at least, to work through that process if the acceptance of the petition is accepted. And then the actual proposal to do that annexation comes back to the council, and the council will have a chance to discuss, pros and cons of annexation. We I've never seen one of those go through without a first and second reading. Counsel not if you agree. And there will also be a special public hearing, as we consider the actual annexation. That being said, this is your time to stand up. If you if you would like, we welcome you to stand up and, let the council know what you're thinking about. We do have a a full agenda. We during this kind of public comment period, we we appreciate it if you can stay on point and try to keep comments to two minutes. Okay? So who would like to address the council? Please come forward. And there's a sign up. I could call you out. Caleb Kimber. We're just gonna do that. Oh, it's okay. It's not And you don't have to sign up if you wanna speak to it. Will works. We'll sign on.

Okay. Caleb Kimber. 5330 Hollow Road. Yeah. Tony, to maybe talk about a proposal that you'll be considering in the future. I'm not here to to slam the door on a version. Hollow Road is a unique unique beautiful place. I've spent twenty three twenty three years there and just feel absolutely blessed for having that that opportunity and and that ability to be able to live in that beautiful area. Instead of being not in my area, I'm more here to urge the council as this process moving forward to change the zoning designation from the the current designation into an agricultural designation. This this would adjustment would match the current and historic use of the property. I would've been right? We all we all live there. And I think there's some risk threats and concerns that have been mitigated yet in this in this process so far. Well, many of my neighbors and brands have discussed it in zoning declining committees. But there are there are real concerns. There are real threats and concerns. There are risks and risks and threats and concerns. The problem is in the midly future plan. We're gonna take part in that process through the zoning planning. We learned that the the consultant that identified the property proposed relaxation as a high risk area. They identified it for flood, fire, wind, earthquake, and all those type of natural, risks and threats for that inquiry. But the client didn't have any way to mitigate those, threats and risks. So that that's a a concern that we we need to probably discuss as we talk about this annexation proposal. The other one I'd like to discuss is the impact of the current. Right? That's probably why many of us keep showing up to to discuss this topic. Under those, personally, I live on on in the county. We're adjacent to the property, and I'm on a a well. So there's lots of discussions about the offer, the recharge zone, no matter offer, how do we navigate that or at least get a study done for that? So that that's a primary concern for me as a for investment in the area is I've gotta get a drink. So if we're impacting recharge zone with the aquifer, I think that probably needs to be studied before we move forward. The second one you'll hear a lot about is the traffic. It's a very narrow road. I walked out there today and faced off. It's about around 22 feet right there in front of my my house. That's what a lot of people are concerned about. Now I I did a quick check, the Middle East New Road standards is 28 feet wide. So if you're gonna think five, six feet doesn't sound like a lot, and when big trucks whizzing by yet, it means a lot. Right? Build that extra five or six feet you have. Now point two feet is from bunch graph to bunch graph. Right? There's no shoulder. There's no sidewalks. So when when a truck does come barreling down the street, you have one or two rock beams, jump into the grass, or possibly become road pizza. Right? So that that's one of the big concerns you'll hear from many people, rural people in the area.

So, Caleb, we're we're about at three minutes. Are you able to wrap this up? Yeah. Just a moment.

So so, again, in order to help mitigate the risk of the. We designated as agricultural. That case from a two acre to about five acre minimum for for any their development meets a historical use of the property, minimum heightens and spreads those those threats and risk identifying the future by wildfire's bloods, and helps reduce the aquifer breadth as well as the traffic load concern, which is already set. So, again, I just totally urge for a booking setting in place. If you have decide to proceed annexation, I really urge that we redesignated as. Okay. So Thank you. Thank you. We

this is this is the public's time. We won't address comments tonight. I'm making notes. I've made notes. These are things we'll probably take up when we consider the actual annexation or have time to do some study between if if the petition is successful. Great. Thanks for coming out. Appreciate your time, man. Yeah. How about Diane Malmquist? Can we get the timer on the screen? Because then I don't have to be the bad guy. It's a little more self regulating. Clock. So hang on. It's just the clock. Yeah. And then I don't know. Stopwatch or that's the thing. Gotta change it now. Just change this. There we go. Okay. And I won't be a hard ones about it, but that that will help focus you. How's that going? K. Thanks.

Okay. Middle East City Council members. My name is Diane, and I am the concerned mother living in Unincorporated County Half 5400 roof near the proposed annexation by, 5325 with the property owner being the act. I would like to state my concerns for my family and neighbors living along the whole road, whether they are an unincorporated half county or a deadly resident. My fir first point I would like to address is the safety of which is already a critical issue. The post dispute limit at 25 miles per hour is rarely followed and seldom enforced by law officers. At either end of the proposed annexation are blank hearts. As there is no sidewalk or shoulder areas, I have personally had to jump out of the way of the vehicle not paying attention, advise the to walk down its narrow road to the. We also get additional traffic from the Blacksmith for a canning visitor using it at the byway instead of going up the driveway heading up the hill. Many vehicles going after half were going well over its stated 25 mile per hour. And this past summer, I reported a driver going 90 mile per hour coming around the Glen Corner. The driver slammed on his brakes and left an impressive tire burn that the officer was able to calculate the speed of over 93 miles per hour. Children's, pets, adults, horse rider, road bikers, and wildlife use his road, and it is clearly already unsafe. The increase of more people from a subdivision result in life lost and our quality of life gone permanently. Several years ago, a neighbor out walking his dog was killed, And two years ago, another young man walking his dog was hit and injured while the truck just kept on driving. If this annexation is approved and moves forward, may I recognize speed bumps or this strategically placed along the entire lane to follow-up to create safer drivers? My next concern I would like to address is a very high poverty taxes. We chose to live in unincorporated with a rural beauty and are free to have farm animals and larger private property. I have lived in Cache Valley my whole life The uniqueness and rare opportunities my children have had being raised in home broke with these amazing neighbors who share our love of open space, privacy, and security with this area. We bought an older modest home twenty years ago for 2,200,000, and our property cap has reflected an accurate appraisal price. Over the years, our home and property taxes have rapidly increased in comparison with other homes of our side in Cache Valley with the staggering appraisal price of 953,000 as of 2025. Our salaries haven't increased enough being to pay these taxes, and many of our neighbors are older on fixed incomes. We are already being priced out of our homes by fiat rates that the county has attached to our property, but with the potential of a very upscale subdivision being considered with a handsome property that we fear we no longer will be able to pay the taxes to keep love living in our modest country without help. This is very disheartening to me and all those in the potential. My final issue is that of the low water of my family in. So we can compromise your account and the product construction of the. We are one of seven homes that are part of the water company that has fibers used in the home, either touching the proposed annexation property or in a very close distance, which concerns us about the lateral springs that are to my knowledge, by the Niddly City or the developers have evaluated or tested the water impact for this area. I ask that you please carefully evaluate our situation and if it is wise and prudent to allow a property owner and developer to turn across at our expense and walk away from the crushing impacts they hope to have.

Okay. Thank you.

Counseling, what do you want me to do about two minutes? Got it. Great. And then I'm gonna cut it off at great. K. Thanks. Dave or Sandra or both? Or you can you can each have three minutes.

I'm I'm Dave Widel. I live at 4570

Hollow Road. There's 3000. I'll keep this brief. I'll open the express reviews previous meetings and be writing to the city council members. But I have noticed this annexation on a number of points five points. One is safety as Caleb and others have brought up the mind that the traffic on Halloween is dangerous, and adding another 14 or 14 houses and 20 or 30 vehicles. Well, this exacerbates that danger. So that's my main concern about this annexation and subdividing that would follow the data, r two, and so need. There's also the well, the impact of the city infrastructure as it's been brought up. Is there sufficient water in the subdivision? Sewer, wind, roofing, etcetera. I think the city might be taking on burden if this annexation and following subdivisions improve. Loss of agriculture, we're seeing across the valley, and Nickelodeon is getting gobbled up. And someone has to say no at some point and and stop this rampant development for profit and try and preserve the rural heritage of our community. While we've been able to have a new we're in the frequency. I've seen foxes, deer, turkeys, intestines in this area with this proposed annexation, and that will all be positive to acre, you know, branch branch expert in there. And then finally, this will impact quality of life of other people living on the Hollow Road. There will be increased noise, increased traffic, light pollution. It'll impact the quality of life of people living there. And so I I oppose this annexation and subsequent donation for R two. Now as Kale brought up and I thought about this earlier this morning, an alternative or kind of a compromise would be an ag zoning designation, which would reduce the impact by about two thirds of going to an R 2.

K. Thank you, doctor Laidel. Sandra, do you want, white cat?

Good evening. I'm Sandra Rindell. I have just 40 points to the Main Hallow Road. Everything that has been expressed is concerning for me. We are quite a bit Lots of the wildlife, the water, the noise pollution already exploded in our area. And and some of that is utility, and some of that is just more housing, more housing. It's it's totally disruptive to the heritage and the culture of the city and road in Detroit.

It is a prime piece of property. And as stated about property,

this year, we filed an appeal because the rates are outrageous. And as we see it, it's only going to increase because this infrastructure is going to be active, and it will impact everybody, not just Hollywood Highlands, but in Italy City in particular. We already pay as we come across. There's insurance issues, of course, you know, the fire zone that they say we're in fire zone, and beautiful area. Honestly, I don't think people even can get mortgages and how it is between their insurance mandates and just being able to afford a house.

And these houses are not going to be inexpensive

in any way, shape, or form, whether two acres or five acres. They're going to be a be expensive. I worry about safety. We don't have fire. We police. We don't have medical, anything like that. We add more community. Again, that adds to cost stability. Those are my concerns and always the safety.

But, anyhow

Great. Thank you. Who else would like to speak? K. Okay. Coming out, Again, the agenda items are not is there a moment? Oh, yeah. Cheryl, I'm sorry. Can we wait? I received a copy of this. Can you get through that in three minutes? I will try. You're the best.

You're right.

You're right into the record. Please accept the following of the public comment agenda item nine. The main set of meeting. We would ask that it be ready to the public record and include it in the minute. Our names are. And we live at 4850 In Whole Road in Medley. This north will be considered for annexation and we strongly support that we said the annexation should prefer their consideration. We believe that acting this property is in the best interest of the city and the rest of us. That's how I believe it's not void. If it does, we believe it's much better for New York City to maintain control for that development, but rather than making that decision without restriction. As we understand that the most suitable use is low density residential with the applicant requesting road to stay zoning. So we believe that is the best case scenario for those of us who live on the road. Our home sits on 3.7 acres, and many of the properties along that road will reach one, five acres, two acre lots with the well, the current character to build the neighborhood. My concern is that if Nibley designs this application, the landowner should be built through development through another path. Since this area is is within Nibley's adaptation plan, denying it could create unnecessary risk and uncertainty, whereas the property owners could potentially look to instead of what happened Instead, if that happened, Pirate may have different expectations for density and infrastructure, which could result in more homes, more traffic, and then a development pattern that is less consistent with the existing helper. We understand that adaptation does not. Every detail of the future development is approved today. However, accepting the petition for further consideration allows NIMHIP to stay involved, evaluate the issues, address utility and infrastructure concerns, and help shape the outcome in a way that protects the surrounding area. For those reasons, we support agenda item nine and encourage the city council to accept the annexation consideration. Thank you, Barb and Rebecca Balder.

Thank you, Cheryl. Again, the pros and cons will come with, and any discussion will come with future meetings. Anyone else want to hear the council on any public comment? Welcome. Okay. Seeing none, we'll move on with the rest of our agenda. And let's take a planning and zoning commission report. Claire, good to see you tonight. Thanks for coming out. Claire's on our planning commission. I assume you're Yeah. We we haven't had a meeting since the last city council meeting.

So

We'll say that's the report there. Yep. Okay. That is just, like, perfect

You doubled up on us. Sometimes we double up on you. But You lap on us more.

Yeah.

Okay. Great. We do have a chance for staff to briefly address the council if I see several staff members here. Steve, do you wanna start us off? Yep. So I'll just take a few minutes on. That's for three minutes as well. Maybe Start the time. Be real brief. We're

we're gonna have the same time to hire. We think that was very successful. We need to be a lot less traffic in you know, coming from the North or from the South of the North. So

we've got some different ideas for next year. We're running up higher, but just maybe, you know, little little different ideas of how we manage. So I'd say it was very successful.

Also Hey, Steve. Quick question. How many dumpsters did you fill up?

We I we did.

I would say 12 dumpsters per w.

Week. Monday, we have one full garage band. One full greenway's band. Okay. And Friday, when when after. I don't think anything more. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So

and we just didn't know how to prepare last time on the day. So

better better be safe than sorry. Another thing, May 17 through the twenty third is National Public Works Week. I'm encouraging you guys, you know, how to scale your home. Urge you guys, your families to do this. And, also, on May 29, we'll be packing the the boot truck ramp up with all of the truck trucks to be down there. We'll have local hands on steel stuff that people can do. So

it'll it'll be fine.

And then,

I think, well, two other things, parts is full full full. We've got the same summertime stuff happening in Google and the truth. We we're busy, so we're having good time with that.

Rates, it'll it'll explain to you what these apps are looking like. It was really cool to see. So with we have I hope you can see it.

Yeah. I hope we got about three minute video. This kinda what it looks like. So here, there's a few little pictures, and then we'll go into video.

Got sound?

Yeah. Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. That's cool.

So while it's getting that, these are professional divers? Yeah. It is for a living? They travel around the country? Or Yep. Traveling. Yeah. Actually, I

moved from Salt Lake area, but I actually just came from California from California to us to get sprayed down for any disinfectant. So As they go in. Completely cleansees here. So

yes. Maybe Just

So

So there's only one guy who's got.

So this guy just got a subtle.

Long guy that's down in already. Sorry.

Trying to get it. So now that the statute's limitations is up, my dad used to be a city council member and was over the water department. When I was about 12 years old, he tied a rope around my waist, put a life jacket on me, threw me in that hole, and I had to swim across to the wire to get to the other side so they could hook up some stuff. So I want you to know we've progressed as Nibley City. I don't even think you have any shower.

K. So I hook up sensors, I see. I drag a wire across.

You've had something to do this?

That's the first time I've ever seen it done here. So it'll be on a well, there you find me out. But

we did inspections more frequently. We just got to go in and inspect

the interior of the vehicle as well as to see They're trying to have the top of the bank now. But they they're looking all over the ceiling.

We do have a little bit of work to do on this. We're gonna get some circuit black on the top of what's happening in the water and coming through and the trash.

And it's it's in there and freezes.

So you get spalling on the inside, so it become, you know, the body fall.

The cloud turned the video pretty fine. So we got a whole bunch more we could now we got another thing that as well on our sanitary survey when you start

I don't know. I remember if you put a line and we'll be following.

It's a really good shade.

Another of the water tanks? Yes. This one will be a sticker flash. We could still it doesn't have the other one. Next couple of years, we'll probably have a plan to

get get a liner on that one. It's fine. We're okay, but we did get hit on a 100% survey

was. So Can I ask a question? Mhmm. So when we clean the tanks Yeah. Do they add any extra chemicals into the water system to you know, it's just great eating the

the wrong, like, fish tanks. Yeah. So it's just it it takes to clean to the bowl or not the alright. And absolute corner here,

when I leave our well. So between that and then being clean, have everything clean. There's no as you can see, there's no there's there's no turpulation,

you know, taking place. It's really a new process. So They were just sucking up things. Yeah. Well, that's Yeah.

It was a process. One of these, and we get a quick we can't.

Yeah. And it's been fifteen years at least since anything's been in a quick pay. So fifteen years, we got one quarter ish.

Less than quarter ish. Ten years ago, we drained them. Yeah. And shoveled it because of but this was to go. No. That was not.

They were drained. They weren't clean. It was ready to clean. I said we drained. Yeah. We were ready to clean. But the time that work cleaned out, they went in and shoveled it.

But, Doudell, do you still dive? We could use your work every now and then.

I still have a good Good. Good. Go down a hole full of water.

I'm doing good. Yeah.

So I think that we we, you know, we've said, okay. We can start just to have these a little more frequent. Just let them stay on because I did check if, like, set the integrity of five, and I think that's very important to keep our system on top notch. So Yep. Probably do that and I have every five.

Okay. Very affordable

work

there. So other than that, thank you. Okay. Thank you. It's Steve O'Hison from Public Works. Questions, counsel. K. Okay. You wanna talk to us?

Yeah.

He He has an item on the agenda. Amen.

Then let's move on to the next agenda item. That's a workshop. Fallon, big old Fallon, we appreciate you being here to talk to us about things folks have been chatting with you about in city office, specifically solicitation,

door to door solicitation. Yeah. I I bring him something. Just something brief, and I appreciate the opportunity to present to the council tonight. As it warms up each spring and in summertime, solicitation begins to pick up, and and we receive a couple of calls personally and and full time students that work part time here at what's the date and I get here in the afternoon. So I've only received about four or five calls, but I thought it was something to bring up to Justin and and Larry. Our current code, five point o eight, it's called solicitors, canvassers, peddlers, Internet merchants. It's a great code that's served nearly well, but it's maybe in need of some some updating. So I wanted to present some concerns at some solicit some citizens about solicitation. Currently, pretty much just spells out the requirements in the process for getting a temporary permit for solicitation. It doesn't really provide any prohibitions

on solicitation.

So I did some research, and we're not in Nevada. But you can see I I looked at some other cities and they're coded, you know, some different things that they included in your solicitation code is and what was if there's no solicitation sign or something like Intuit that prohibits the solicitor from knocking. And time of day restrictions, I've seen multiple different ones. The most common is 9AM to 9PM. Some are a little more restrictive than, yeah, 7PM. And if it's a higher drive to cancel for other requirements. And it looks like we require them during the application process. They come in to pay the fee. They get a little card with their picture, their legal name, and business they're working for. So that's something that if this code was to change, would it be a requirement for them? That's generally what they have. Is there any questions from the from the council? Is this something that you'd like more research on or see a couple of minutes for?

Yes. So this is a good job.

Yeah. That was pretty. So in your research, I'm just curious what do you have any examples that you're not like, you of just what the most restrictive or or did you see me? Because I'm so far. I'm just curious. Yeah.

We have here

I think it's Riverton. They have a 10AM to 7PM mountain time. So that that's a little bit more narrow than the 9AM to 9PM. The no solicitation sites, that's pretty general across the board. Some cities have solicitors can't enter without solicit permission, verbal permission from somebody residing or being in the home, including they can't walk into in a garage. You kinda contact me from that door into into the interior. Generally, they're pretty similar, though. I think one city did it, and then all these other cities picked it up. And some are implementing it now, but the majority of those, both locally and statewide, have had

it for twenty and thirty years.

So Sam, yeah, I just have a question about you mentioned a few of the

calls and reports that kinda triggered. One thing I thought about was I've typically tried to tell my neighbors about this. I have them trying to get down to the interior by what they're doing. Bad business just to ask for their the badge that we require and some of those kind of things. But that probably works when it's a business.

Mhmm. Right? Have you gotten any complaints

or nonprofits or maybe, like, Girl Scout cookies, churches. Those kind of things have been wrapped up into these as well as have all been business focused. Thus far, it's only been businesses.

Some that have been licensed with Niddly City and others that have not.

Thank you.

I have a question.

So we don't need people pulling up the

where we want the introduction.

They can say, hey. We're here to seal your driveway. Would you like us to do that? Did we call the new new city office? Or

Yeah. Yeah. If something like that happens, I mean, in your area specifically within the city or in in the county, we are certainly calling as we keep track of that. We wanna make sure that these people are following the the regulations and not bridging. We want to encourage local businesses, but we also don't want to infringe on privacy of of those people there. Now, again, with our code as it currently stands, there there is some limits, but it is not as much, and and so it's tenants.

The first thing I do when somebody rings my doorbell, I don't know if they're trying to sell me something is I ask to see their Nibley City itinerant itinerant sales license. The temporary business license to operate in Nibley City. And most of them have, to be honest with you, but there's a moment ago. Some of them have little background chills there, I think. On the the cooling off rule, Talon, or required three morse rule, the number number three four on your list. I'm I'm kinda thinking the Federal Trade Commission has actually covered that for us already. I'm reading from the Federal Trade Commission's website, consumer advice. They do have a three day cooling off rule that applies well, buyer's remorse rule that applies to something sold to you at your home or your dormitory or at a temporary sales location. So if they set up yeah. If you go to a home show and somebody talks to you in the buying something in a temporary sales location, you actually have a three day ride to change your mind. So didn't. I'm not we can we can think about whether Nibley City needs to out into the Federal Trade Commission, but I think that they've probably given some relief from that already.

Yeah. I think a lot of that buyer's right to cancel is is in these notes. But, again, I think these notes have also been around for a while, and so they kinda just started different and and maybe stayed has it. So we have some big conditions to consider a future date. We can look at it.

Maybe we need a Carol, maybe we need a newsletter article if we think it's worth the e to refer to the FTC buyer's right to cancel if if people feel like you're being infringed on in their own homes.

Okay.

Do you guys wanna think about whether we move forward with code amendments? I mean, certainly, times of day makes sense to me. Maybe there are some other things that tell me what you think about a sign that says no solicitation. So I believe people have a right to not be solicited in homes. And what's the correct remedy for that? Is that proper rule of government? Maybe it is. But the the the city didn't put the sign up. I, as a homeowner, would put that sign up. And if I had that sign in my house, maybe I would say, here's enough solicitation sign. I'm not going to speak to you. Course, I've already been bothered at that point. Even if the city were to come in with enforcement, they'll they'd probably already been bothered and then had to re report to the city the the infraction.

So thoughts on that, Aaron? Yes. What's the what's the report what's the punishment for this listed area? The city calls them and says, hey. You're not following the rules?

Well, first, I don't know that we have a rule against

honor and no solicits. So if some of these other cities that have this code, do their associate

Yeah. Their level of what we're seeing is if anyone violates a certain section of their vote, then it would be a $500 plan or a misdemeanor to six weeks in jail. Now, of course, that's I I answered that as maybe the maximum, but that's what they would write. Sometimes it's also I've seen listed at five hundred hours per instance, so we have to be doing that multiple times. Again, I might be heavy handed, but it's see.

I didn't I didn't get to all of these examples that you found yet. Really?

Yeah.

And the ones I did look at, I didn't see anything

that

addressed

I don't know. There's there's a part of community that I want people to feel like or or talk to each other. Right?

But if I have a no solicitation sign, does that mean a gross candle is getting in trouble for not getting in the door? I I just think there's these kind of tiers of bothersome that are different to individuals. And I didn't see any of these folks kind of addressing

those situations, and maybe it's just they wait until

can be member of the lanes. But

did you see any

others? I haven't seen anything in that, and I don't know if we can take a stab at trying to find that, Like you said, on a tiered basis, what is Bob's son and what is acceptable?

Yeah. I see. Again, no problem. It's okay with fundraising. But somebody might have a problem with that. Mhmm. Yeah.

And then just do I feel like I'm supposed to do that?

I mean, I'm just gonna use some advice ahead of the neighbor. Right? Yeah. Just reading. Yeah.

I think that it will require a lot of that emissions.

Well, it's it's gonna be no soliciting business. You know? We we all signed. I'm gonna ask I'm gonna ask since since we're confesey tonight. So I'm not offering, Beshi, yet to show how far I've fallen in to get this job. There there was a time a while back, five years ago when I made a goal to knock on people's doors and ask them what they thought, would improve Nible City. I was obviously campaigning for this office. And when I say how far I've fallen, that that sounds like a politician, which I don't think I was a very good politician on any of those nights because I thought I could spend five minutes per door in a three hour period. You know? I could I could I could do 12 times 36 ounces. I never did more than two houses in one three hour. Because we got into it the same New York City, what would be better, what, you know, what was good, what wasn't bad. And so I'm I'm failed as a door to door door to door solicitor. I'm a complete failure at that. But I did come to a house. I didn't tell you whose house it was. It was Larry Jacobson's house, the guy who has been an umpire, usually citizen here a while back who, frankly, got me elected the first time my name was on the ballot and maybe every time because he he he he's passed on, unfortunately, but he was the salt of the earth, and I really wanted to talk to him. And and they have a no solicitation sign on the floor. So I didn't knock, but I'm gonna ask you all if you wanna confess if you're out doing door to door, if you knocked down doors that had no solicitation.

Yes. I'm asking Nathan's point. What is solicitation? Is this soliciting anything including opinions or is it just for money, for profit? So I think that that might be helpful in this code if we if we get implemented to define all those things. Can you ask for, yeah, can you ask for opinions? Is going door to door asking for ballot signatures? Is that solicitation? Or is that something different? I don't but that's something I would wanna look into. Okay.

So I'll confess to that if if you wanna pull that up. Do you have in the last last summer, we were doing this campaign thing that I instructed me and and he was helping me to not put a flyer or to knock on a door that had that sun. And I did not have a door with his son.

Mostly because I didn't wanna hear what they said. Can't you read?

I didn't wanna have that conversation. I just figured they they made the decision. They don't want me to bother, you know, without worrying about what's come what's coming in. I'm not selling anything, but at the same time, I felt like that sign means much more to me than just selling. It's it it says, I don't wanna be I don't wanna be bothered, so I don't.

Yeah. Thanks. So I'm I'm still gonna ask counsel to think about who the proper role of government and enforcement. Alright. What do you wanna do? Think about it. Let me know. Tell him maybe he's to coordinate the spearhead the effort. Be okay with that. Ideally, that was comments. Let me know if you want it on, but, James, I will will draft work with you to draft the change the order and see how you want to go. That's one more question. Yeah, please. To you or anyone else.

I'm assuming, you know, as the whether it's human being the context of fire here, I mean, is this a is this not the first time that this converse or that this body has had this conversation before or is this the first time? I'm just curious.

I have twenty five years of experience. This is the first of all. Really? Mhmm.

Now five of those were on by the commission that would not think about stuff like that. So I'm saying twenty years of experience of the council Haven't had this conversation before.

Doesn't mean it's not important. Yeah. It is. I'm just curious.

I think we had an over there. Yeah. Yeah. I think with the warmer season, maybe we've got calls a little bit earlier, and so we're

maybe

just worried that we might get more. And it's looked down a little bit, but some people were were were pretty bothered that we didn't have COVID.

Yeah. Yeah.

I I mean, I'm situation like this. It's always at a minimum. We had to reflect upon our own code, see how out of days you are. We've had that recently. Other context and sales, you just see what others are doing.

Yeah. I'll let you guide me

regarding the work. Thank you, Tal. Appreciate it.

Okay. Let's get into number eight. Eight and nine, just so it gets excited about seeing eight before we could see nine. Eight and nine are really two different agenda items, but also related to one another. So start with eight, if you would, and then then we'll then we'll move on to number nine. Eight is eight and nine are both about annexation.

Right. So, Rachel and Trevor Hansa, they they submitted an annexation petition previously. And the reason eight is on the agenda is that this that petition had been changed. It's been they they have a new petition. There's really not a way to formally amend a petition. So, really, the only way forward to consider another one would be to deny the old one and then and then consider the new one. There's there's a provision in state code that says it either have to deny or approve it. It doesn't really give you another out. So that's the reason for this. This first one is just is and and and staff is recommending denial of that annexation so that the other annexation could be considered the other annexation petition could be considered.

And when we talk about that one, will you talk about why you know, what changed between the two, or do you wanna talk about that? Sure. I I I can bring it up now. I'll Either way, if you wanna save it for a number of minutes just around the corner.

There really, there there's just a couple of of changes I'll I'll just mention if you you follow, I guess I can use this. One is in the county, their their first annexation petition had a half road for Hollow Road instead of instead of the full right of way. The county has requested the the full right of way, and and we our staff has been in support of that idea. So this annexation petition shows the full right of way of Hollow Road. And then there was a little gap here that would've there would've been an unincorporated island that was created. You can see these this little property here about a quarter of an acre that is the Nielsen Nielsen family. It's it's part of their property, but the boundary for the city doesn't go to the right of way. It actually cuts off a portion of their property, and so this annexation petition would also include that that sliver of land. So because this was a change, that that really triggered needing to start over the process again. But, yeah, those are those are the differences.

Perfect. Thanks. Questions for Levi? I can turn it to counsel for consideration.

We have a motion to the end of it.

We We have a motion from the aid, a second from Nick to deny the first annexation proposal. So this is not denying the petition. This is denying the annexation. Discussion from the council.

Questions? Let's see.

Cheryl, can we do this with a voice, or do you wanna call the roll? What do you think? I think you voice. Yeah. That's what I'd say. There's no resolution associated. Is there any opposition to voting? Saying none of those in favor of denial, your whole words, in favor of denial, please say aye. Aye. And any opposed to denial? Okay. The motion for denial passes unanimously. Okay. Let's move right on to number nine then. I'm gonna start number nine. Go for it. Although I have no personal gain from this possible annexation on Howell Road, I would like the council and public to know that I am a part time employee of the Utah Water Research Lab, and the director of the Utah Water Research Lab is listed as a minor landowner in this petition. If the council would like me to step down, let someone else run a meeting, whatever, I won't be voting. I would never vote except to break the tie because I do have an employer who the director of my employ the director of my employment is a landowner. I would never vote on this. But if you don't want me to conduct a meeting and be part of the discussion, I'll leave that to you. And you can decide as we go along, or you can tell me to get out of the way now. Okay. That's my disclosure. Go ahead.

Alright. So so, yeah, the this this annexation petition includes I'm not I'm not gonna explain it all verbatim, but it includes these properties at at approximately 5300 South Hollow Road. I'll show it on the map. Next, it's it including the right of way, it's about 31 acres. And just to be clear, this has been explained, previously in the meeting. But at this stage, the city council is only considering whether to accept this annexation petition for further consideration. If if this is accepted for further consideration, there there then would be a protest period, and then a public hearing would be held at which time the the annexation would be considered for approval, including signing the zoning. So, again, this is this is the area. It's primarily owned by the the the Hansons. They're they're there's about 28 acres there on those those properties down near about 5300 South Hollow Road. And so I'll I'll go to this next one just to give you a little bit more context so you can see where this is at. But you can see it backs on to the, Blacksmith Fork River, and then Hollow Road there is is to the left. So it's that that area there just south of of Nibley City. The area the area is within the city's annexation declaration boundary of the annexation policy plan, and it would be contiguous with existing city boundaries. But it it is worth noting that it's this con contiguity is only possible by connecting the property via the Hollow Road right away. There really is a a very short gap between one property to this one. We we did consult with our attorney on this if if this would meet state code, and they they concurred that it that it does. The city could, through the right of way boundary, annex it if if the the city chooses the city council chooses to do so. It would create an unincorporated peninsula, and this is allowed by by state code provided that the county and and and the municipality have otherwise agreed. The Cache County Council has has already considered this, and they have agreed to to approve the unincorporated peninsula creation. And then the the property is is intended to be developed as low density residential. They've requested the rural state zoning. Again, this the zoning will, really is is meant to be considered at the annexation, but just for for that background, although the planning commission, just just for your information, has considered that already. We've had a public hearing as well. There there was a concern. This was expressed previously with with the last, annexation petition of water pressure sufficiency in this area, and this came out of the water master plan. The water model was was run, and there were some identified forecast deficiencies and potential remedies for that. But just wanted to put that on there that that that there has been some some research there done, but we we're we suggest to kinda bring that back as this is considered at a future meeting. Staff's recommendation is to accept the annexation petition for further consideration.

And and just

considering look looking at the side, there's there's a few issues here. One, I I mentioned the the water. And so just to ensure that that that issue is addressed as well. Another issue is the roadway. So it's and and Tom or or Justin, if you wanna chime in, it the the current Hollow Road, adjacent to this property on the other side of it, it's there's a steep embankment there, and and our master plan shows additional right of way width. And so we're we're thinking we would like to talk with the property owner to you know, the typical the typical way of doing this is to take half the right of way on one side of the road and then half on the other side. But it it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to take it half on the other side. So if there's a way that we can negotiate that and get the full right of way with the that's in the master plan. I think it's 66 feet. So what we have on their side of the road, that's something we could discuss with them. And then the other thing is is, address this, water pressure issues. If we can get those into an annexation agreement and bring that back to the council, we we think that that would that that would be a good thing to do just just so that we can make sure that those issues are addressed prior to annexation. So we just putting that as a similar to a previous, annexation petition just to give direct we'd recommend to give that direction to pursue this annexation agreement. And and we have talked to the applicant, and they've and and they're definitely amenable to to having those discussions.

So to be clear, right of way acquisition is not to go to another property owner, but but the full right of way acquisition on the petitioner.

Yeah. Yeah. And we still need to discuss that, you know, with the property owner, but but just kind of giving that as background that we saw that as a a potential issue with this one that, really, if we wanna get the full right of way, it's it's gonna be really difficult to get on on the side of the road with the steep embankment there. So

k.

And when we talk about water pressure, talking about Nibley City culinary water. Correct.

Yep.

Questions for Levi? Discussion? Council?

Yeah. Just I and maybe I'll just say, just in general, staff's recommendation is prime primarily based upon the fact that this is in our annexation plan. And so we feel like it merits, you know, looking at further. It's it's it's in an area that the city has planned for quite some time to to annex into the city.

Eric?

I

have looked. I've looked. Yeah. I is there some overlap here a little bit? Is in.

They updated their plan last when did I show last meeting? I need to actually look in Teams for that to make sure I'm telling the the right You said it was a long time ago. Yeah. 2003.

Like yeah.

But, like, we talked on the West Side of town. So we had a deal with our where we would stop, and it turns out we don't have a deal. It was never it was never a more and more and it was never put into an agreement that you know, about where our taxation boundaries would what we would do to make them an out of the lab.

And and looking at Hireup's current city boundary on Hollow Road, I'm just looking at some of the property sizes, and it doesn't list on the cash parcel viewer what the zoning designation is. But many of them look like there is a newer development, which is a chokecherry Chowcherry. In which which are not two acre. Right? They're much smaller than two acre lots.

Right.

Give us some examples. While she's looking

oh, man. Oh, yeah. I'm I'm going to sell on the resort too. So I I don't know what he can

pay two means to to look at it. So I'd be lucky. Yeah.

The average one, I'm just clicking on some of these parcels. They vary between three quarters and an acre, acre and hamster. So

And how far from the proposed petition is Hiram Citi?

I think You can pull that up on the I can pull that up on here. That shouldn't be too hard for me.

Not expecting.

If you go up the hill, it's pretty close.

To the Kilgore

mine, 600 feet.

Mhmm.

I'm just asking because I was trying to get an idea of what Iram's plan might be K. For for the area putting our two cities on hold.

Good question. It would be it'd be great to work that out on the West and the East side.

So,

I mean, this is Hiram right here. So, really, there's there's

That piece of that.

How much?

Yeah. Something like that. Yeah.

They got down the spot.

No. That would granted, that would pay the

well, maybe it would take the cooperative landowner between the petition property and Hiram City.

Mhmm.

It's not unless Hiram brought them in as a minor landowner and a larger issue larger annexation proposal.

We already got the formal letter from one landowner saying they did not. He put

in any sort of What is the one? The the blouse.

We we got fired Yeah. Few months ago saying they didn't wanna be connected with the or included in the annexation. Yeah. Okay.

So just following up on that. And, again, not to say yay, nay, or anything else. Just thinking about what could happen because it's in Hiram's annexation plan. Hiram, it has status as an entitled protester

to this petition. Correct. K. Yeah. Yeah. So they'll get noticed on that. And I think even if it wasn't in their annexation plan because of their proximity, I think that they they can protest. I know that we were for a Millville annexation recently. There wasn't an overlap, but we we got the notice, and we were we could have protested.

But, Levi, walk me through the work process. If they do protest, what happens?

It then if it's protested, I believe and correct me if I'm wrong, Cheryl, it would go to the boundary commission for consideration. And then the the boundary commission could weigh in on

The boundary. I think I think the boundary commission makes a recommendation to the Harris County Council. Oh, okay. That's right.

No? Is that right? No. No. I think they make the decision. Yeah. I think they

So we we protested city. Oh, we've done. Comes about. Yeah. They protested We protested property in the subdivision in the 800 plus or something. When they when that property owner asked to be annexed into Logan, we protested but lost my.

Yeah. In general, just and I'm I'm not saying the same thing would happen, but if from what I recall from that experience, the the boundary commission at the time don't wanna, again, don't wanna get too much into the weeds, but it seemed like the decision was largely based on the property owner's wish, and they that that seemed to be kinda their finding is that's what the property owner wants to do, so that that's what we're gonna allow. Yeah.

It's not the right way for cities. You guys know this. It's not the right way for cities to decide what's gonna be eventually in one pack and what's gonna be eventually in the lockdown or not in any town because I really feel like the the property market was an experience in a developer city shopping from one city to the next as to who could give them the best deal. So what I was here for is Strata Norpa, Bartleby Nature Park, who came to Italy asking for multifamily residential housing, and he said, we don't even have that zone, so we're not we're not gonna consider a annexation for you. And I said, okay. And they went to.

So, like,

I think city shopping doesn't lend itself to good retail. Right.

Eric? Yes. Just real quick. Search on Harv's web page. I believe our two was 9,900 square feet, which is just under a quarter eight. Quarter eight. That's high that's real quick dirty.

Yeah. Other thoughts? Yeah. Again, we're not we're talking about things that we should be thinking about or talking about whether to accept the petition for Adexes. I I think that we need to address the concern on a local well. I'm not exactly sure, Tom, the engineer, how we go about you you know, I'm not I'm not saying we should have done that by now, but we need to think about whether development on this property would have water rights impacts. Maybe it's state water rights that decides that. So you'll be sitting out of there. Do you know what I'm talking about? A potential possible

impact on a a local culinary supply. Yeah. So we do that on culinary wells for purposes. We do source protection, evaluation. It's through an hydrogeologic engineering specialized in that. Okay. We we've worked with one in the past. If you recall, just above there, there was a septic tank just above this area. That was approved. It was approved through the evaluation from the hydrogeology.

K. Yeah. Right. Okay. So we there were then there's a possibility

if

counsel's so direct staff and we can enter into, say, annexation during the source, we can pass that cost on to And we can pass the condition. Pass the cost to the potential developer. Correct. Okay.

Anything else?

We'll we'll get back into it in a bit, but go ahead. Yeah. Just I'm gonna I'll make a motion just to approve or accept the annexation petition. You would

ask a motion from the second from Aaron to accept the petition or not for annexation. And we get to keep talking about.

So, Eric, Larry, forgive me. This is where I ask you. Yeah. Forget me. Thank you. In in this stage, I mean, let's say this passes and then we see the petition. Then we move forward with we move forward with questions now and direct staff now. I think this is gonna happen next week. We've got an exception acceptance of efficient or any questions of staff, or do we wait for the next let's come back.

You can ask questions of staff at any point. Okay. Yeah. Like, action.

I think that's helpful. It's productive so that because it what you because if we come back again and we don't and we don't have any direction, then it just delays it just delays the process. If you if you if you have direction now, I think it's helpful to give that that general direction so that when when we come back, we've got something for you. That

I'd call you this week. I'm gonna proceed with council. Forget about the. And this whole

protest period starts to block with all these other things.

I've never seen this counsel. I shouldn't second guess this counsel. I've never seen any counsel accept an annexation in one reading. So between, typically, between, you know, how we operate between first and reading, second readings. We say, oh, I'm not sure about this, and I have questions about this. And that's an additional period of time to to see if, you know, this thing gets passed. County's test, whether Hiram is going to protest and so on. But there's an additional chance between first reading and second reading of accepting the annexation to direct counsel and tell your company. Doesn't mean you can't talk about it now here. I think maybe don't come up with big ticket items yet because we should see perhaps if it gets past this this first Correct. This first battle. But but it gives give direction for for sure. Sounds like Levi wants it. Yeah.

I think it helps.

Alright. I got some direction for us. We have an annexation policy plan that's due in 2018. We have recently

approved a new general plan.

In the annexation policy plan, 2018, it very clearly, based upon current state code back then as well as our current general plan back then, gives things that we should be considering. I mean, annexing land or even just parking, which we had before in it.

We should read that.

Specifically for staff, there's a section that talks about the estimated tax consequences, residents within municipal boundaries and in the expansion area

is something we're supposed to consider.

And something stood out to me that says city staff, back in 2018, have completed the analysis of property tax per acre and utility fee question for specific types of development, and we'll apply this when considering areas proposed for annexation. Mostly emphasizing, he does not intend to raise taxes in order to support future annexations.

I don't know if we still know that

or if it's anywhere close to what it was in 2018.

Probably changed quite a bit. Probably changed a little bit.

So when it comes to annexation,

it's hard to keep up today with your.

But it's not always the solution, and I think it's important for us to recognize that can the type of development

that is proposed

or annex, so in this case, it would be world of states,

cover its better title?

That is the bottom line thing.

And I have my doubts

but anything will go to have risk maintenance

costs. And then is that maintenance and the value of those problems

exacerbated by proposed selling, I just mentioned? So, you know, we had some suggestions from from citizens tonight to keep it agricultural.

And that's a great idea, but maybe this site is awful for agriculture. We should test the soil. Right? There's a lot of things that we can test and decide if it's an economical good decision,

and if if it's a better outcome.

But I would say that we should follow what is in our 2018 plan with the context of and the lens of

the new general plan we just passed.

So I would like staff to look into the tax per acre, etcetera, impacts on these residents as well as all the residents of Midland. I know that's a hard lift, and I don't have specifics, but that's what our plan says to do.

Yeah. I think I think there's a I don't know, Justin. I probably need some help on this if and I I guess I don't need to be the one that takes it on. But but I think looking at what the revenue is for the development and then what are the estimated maintenance costs of all the infrastructure that would need to support the development with you know, there need to be some assumptions could get you close to that that number. Does

that

does that make sense? Some Sure. Yeah.

Something.

Right. Because it's going to be a it's going to be a tax burden if if the revenue we get from the development doesn't cover the the maintenance cost of what it adds to the city, if we can somehow estimate those thing.

Maybe sort of soil test, which I'm not opposed to. We could talk to the guy that's been farming for a long time.

They tend to know a lot of work.

A lot of. I hate to extrapolate what you're saying about Hollow Hollow Road because I I'm hoping you're not gonna find a remedy that says we e addicts. No.

You know, like, the services.

We see whether I'm paying for that.

The original Nibley, it'd be kinda weird to be NX. Right?

Yeah. There's a great history there about water.

I I know you're right. I don't think economic decisions are the only decision to consider financing, but I we have been vastly underinformed.

Yeah. I would love to know. It's not strictly an economic decision, but as we look at in our brand new general plan, a variety of housing types, right, all the way from two acre residential to multifamily attached housing with substantially higher debts. I'm I'm curious to know what's the what are those costs versus rewards Yep. For different types of house? I'm not I'm not willing to let that be the only decider. I don't know if we zone things, but I would I would like to go.

And if you're going to this stage, the annexation is helpful for all the things Apollo, such as, etcetera.

We we might be we might be scared of what we find. Any other discussions? Any opposition to voting to its evolution? K. Let's and vote. And I'm just gonna I'm just gonna do this with a voice call. If I can't barely call both, we we'll do a voice call one at a time. Those in favor of accept this petition for annotation, please say aye. Those of us, we say name.

Okay. So the petition is acceptance. Yes.

Let's move right along to a possible change to ordinance regarding accessory buildings, small setback, smaller setback, small accessory drilling. So this is our first reading, and it comes to us with a recommendation from the planning commission. Claire, thanks for your good work on that. You and Claire. Thanks, Claire. I'm like I'm saying thank you to the planning commission for your your good work on the recognition or accessory bill. Do you guys move through that? I think I think fast. So we'll wait until you see what we do. Levi, will you introduce that for us?

Yeah. So, in general, we the our staff and and the city council, when discussing, some provisions of of our accessory building code, has noticed that there's there's some provisions in there that are that are that make it difficult to to build a shed even and particularly a small shed on your property, something that doesn't even require a building permit, something under, you know, 200 square feet. There's it's it's quite restrictive. And and just with some additional research, it's it's a lot more restrictive than at least most communities we looked at. So the current code requires that all accessory building buildings regardless of size or permanence need to adhere to setback requirements, which are

are

for a lot of a lot of lots, quite restricted to the point where they you then you might not even find a place to put your shed that's really very feasible on your property depending on your lot size and and and the way your lot's configured. All buildings must be placed outside of restrictive easements, including public utility easements as well. Those also that also becomes a problem for for many of them that you know, with these small sheds where they're, you know, they're they're trying to put it in a specific corner. They're a lot so and then these recommendations are primarily based upon planning commission and and their feedback. They they held the workshop, and then and then based upon the direction in that workshop, staff drafted the changes, which are mostly focused on on this issue, and then and then they are bringing forth the recommendation to you. So what is being recommended is to remove rear and side yard setback requirements for accessory buildings that do not require a building permit. So it'd have zero setback, except for they do they they would still need to be outside of the front yard area. The it would also allow accessory buildings that do not require building permit. I didn't finish that sentence. To to be placed on to all accessory buildings that do not require a building permit to be placed in a public utility easement if they're if they're placed on renewable skids. We saw some precedents here. And and, really, if if if someone, you know, utility provider wants to go in there, it could it could be moved, and that would really be between the property owner and the and the utility company. They could they could move it. They could move it themselves or they could require it to be moved. But, the reality is, I'll I'll point to kind of this issue, there are a lot of these all over the community that are not compliant with our with our coach. Just just at first blush. So just putting that out there that that it is an issue. That shouldn't be the only reason for this, but and the and the planning commission really was just looking at reasonableness with a small tool shed that, you know, people are just trying to put put their lawn mowers and whatever other small belongings in there. Another thing that is recommended is to allow accessory buildings in agricultural zones prior to a principal building. So right now, you you can't build an accessory building prior to building the home. That's not necessarily practical if it's an agricultural use, and they don't plan on building a home there for, you know, the foreseeable future. But we do have that restriction, which I think I for other zones, I I think it does make some sense so that you reserve that, you know, that buildable area for the principal building. But at least at this time, it's being recommended to remove it for agricultural zones. And we did see that some examples of that with other cities as well. There's also this section in the code just reviewing it. You know, a lot of times we review these and we kinda question, you know, why why we have things the way we are. There's a section on prohibited accessory building and structures that speaks to tents, trailers, mobile homes. That is not really, in in my mind, very enforceable, and it's not very practical. For one thing, a tent isn't a building. So it really in my mind shouldn't be listed. Neither is a trailer. It's it's it's not a building. So if if we want to regulate where trailers go, this probably isn't the best place to do that. And in general, the way it's written in the code currently is that you can't use a trailer as an accessory building. I'm guessing what that means is you can't use it as, like, a storage unit, but it's being recommended to just remove that section entirely. And then there's also a section on nonconforming uses that is in some some ways, the way it's written is redundant to another code on, nonconforming uses, and and there are some inaccuracies as well. So staff record and and the planning commission recommends removing that section on nonconforming uses. It's covered by another one, and it's it's really more appropriate the way it's written in that other section. So that is what's being recommended, and both staff and planning commission recommends approval. You could bring up the specific code language if you'd like, but that's the background.

Questions for Levi?

I'll ask one.

I appreciate your statement that There are a lot of tools sheds and such accessory buildings in Nibley that are noncompliant with our current code. Do these recommendations remedy that?

A lot of them. It would. A lot of them would for sure. Yeah. I one thing I'll one thing I'll say too because there is a qualifier on although there's a zero setback, there's still a provision that you can't, for example, drain water onto your neighbor's property. You can't overhang onto your neighbor's prop property. But but, yeah, I mean, in in most instances, at least at first blush, I I think it would make a lot of these complain. And it's just it's just the staff found the planning commission found that it's just a lot more reasonable the way that this is written. The issue with it now and and one avenue we we thought about is, well, if we are going to regulate these, part of the issue is we don't require a permit. And so when people put their sheds in, we say the what we currently do is say, well, you can do that, but you need to do your due diligence and make sure that you meet setbacks and you're out you know, that you're putting it in the right place. What we're finding is people aren't looking up newly city code. If they don't go through that process of of getting a permit and and frequently, you know, we we get we get quite a few accessory building permit, zoning clearance applications. And frequently, when we get those, I would say more than half of the time, they're not compliant when they submit the application. They think they are, but they might need to move it three feet here, or they might need to move it 20 feet there. And some of them, even if they have someone professionally that's helping them out with it, a contractor, they they still aren't quite meeting the city code. And so for us to say, well, you don't need to get a permit, but you still need to comply. The only remedy really is code enforcement. That didn't doesn't make a whole lot of sense. And then but as we dove into it further in the planning commission, their direction is that it's reasonable to allow people to put a shed on the corner of their property if they're not they're not really hurting anybody doing that. And so And Let's not to be for that. A small shed, that is. They don't need to.

200 square feet or less, and there's no plumbing in

Right. There's no oh, yeah. Under under 15 feet in height, 200 square feet, and it's defined it's defined in our code. It's not defined in this section, but it is defined in our code. Yeah. But it's driven by billing code, that one. I mean, it's driven by billing code. And Well, actually, I think there it I can pull up this section. I I think it does speak to it specifically in this in this section of code as well. Let me let me pull that up. I think it does define that. Where we at? What item? Nine. Or 10. Sorry. Yeah. It it does define it actually here. Zoning clearance permit and building permits required for accessory buildings greater than 120 square feet in industrial, commercial, and neighborhood commercial zone or 200 square feet in a residential zone. It also says in excess of 15 feet.

Yeah. I I probably wasn't clear. I remember when I went from a 120 square feet in residential to 200 square feet in our code. Yeah. That was because building code changed.

Right.

So that's the question I'm asking is that we're being informed by you don't need a building permit by building code that says you don't need a building permit. Unless we're just going sit down, but I was pretty excited to find out when I wanted to build a 200 square foot shed that I didn't need a building permit to do so, and it was building code that changed

that then changed our ordinance. Yeah. I mean, I think that drove the language in here.

But I think what I'm trying to point out is it's not a arbitrary 200 square feet. Maybe it's 300 next year. I don't know. But it's it's driven by building code. Right, Tom? Yeah.

Yeah. Thanks.

Appreciate that intro. Nick, question.

If I recall, some of the frustration from some of our citizens as well has been in in their efforts too already. Like, should you give example of, like, hey. We have get our due diligence. Right? And that not being, like, based on our interpretation. The fire code thing came up a few times. Just curious to know if you thought we need to add some additional language anywhere to just clarify what that is and what the requirements are so there's no ambiguity to someone who's really trying to follow and make sure that they're meeting the firehood from the house, that we just explicitly describe it in in our ordinance somewhere. We do you think we we need to have that just so it's clear?

Yeah. And, Tom Tom, I don't know or or Justin, I don't know if you wanna comment on this, but I think one thing we need to be careful of is our jurisdiction on that, like, on on the fire code. And, really, the I think the fire marshal can enforce that based on the fire code. What what would you say, Tom?

So, unfortunately, the building code is limited to which license you hold. It's a state requirement that you don't pack outside your license. So, for example, I I believe Austin Powell is certified in the residential code, so he shouldn't be stepping out into the fire codes and things. I I'm certified in the several commercial residential fire code, so I I could make that interpretation. But it really relies on the authority having jurisdiction as how it's defined in each code. And in the case of the fire code, it would be the fire marshal that's that authority. I I can help guide conversations, but the ultimate authority would be the Fire Marshal. In this case, it's

Chase and Win. Chase and Win with CashCare.

And and we seek Fire Marshal it's not approval anymore, but we seek input from fire marshal on subdivision design, length of streets, stuff like that, but but we don't require fire marshal fire inspections. We require building inspections, but Jason Wynn doesn't inspect individual residences.

So this this isn't the residence that post can be shared.

Well, well, we we have some set we have some setbacks, which in some cases are more restrictive than what we've heard is in the fire code. So, like, 10 feet. But but we could we could refer them, I guess, to the fire marshal. They we did we did you know, we do learn some we did learn some things through the process that, in general, what what we've heard is, you know, I I think it's been quoted that, oh, it shouldn't have a five foot clearance if it doesn't have a firewall. We've we've heard that there's actually an exception for if a smaller shed in in Utah's code. But, again, I I I don't wanna speak, like, too much at a turn on this, but there's some nuances and things with it with it that I don't think we were aware of in the past. So

And wanna add. Maybe Austin stepping outside his jurisdiction and I'm reading an email that even though we were enforcing distances between main structure and tool sheds for FireCode, Austin, again, he may not have jurisdictional authority here, but his latest is, there's no building code, so maybe that's within his authority, for accessory structures. After digging deeper, there are no provisions in the building code for accessory structures that allow for tool sheds and storage sheds exempt from a building permit to be within five feet distance and would and be exempt from firewall and penetration. So in other words, there is no fire code. There is no building code about the tools yet being close to your house.

Now I'm thinking Yeah. And I think I think there's again, there's some nuances there with it because it's it's like if it's if it's a small tool shed or something. Like, there are buildings that you you shouldn't put too close to the Right.

So I'm kinda guessing we're maybe doing a first reading here. I don't have a motion, so I'm not sure. But I'm gonna guess at that. That would be one thing. I'm with you, Nick. If you're saying and what if you're saying, let's clean up what we're gonna do about fire code enforcement in a residence in a residential structure. Go for it. Yeah. Maybe you can clean it up for us. So

section 10 governs that in the fire code, and it says accessory structure is related to single family, one and two family dwellings. Mhmm. Reference it back to residential code the international residential code. So any discussion of fire code should not be happening on an accessory structure that's associated with the residential use, a single family residential user.

So does that mean our code Is it the our city? Municipal code should not be addressing

fire code in that case? Correct. When it's related to the residential.

It it it actually, we're actually reaching out to you here. Right? It says detached one and two family dwellings and multiple single family dwelling townhouses. Another one of the three stories go up high and the separate means and beavers and their accessory structure shall comply with the international residential code. So the discussion on fire, but it just doesn't need to happen.

Okay. Nathan? In motion to approve first reading?

A motion from Nathan, second from Nathan to approve for first readings, and let's talk some more. Nathan, why don't you go ahead? But you probably cover what I will see.

Okay.

Okay. I'll jump in if you want.

Levi, I I would like us and that I mean, since we're first reading, you could you could work on it. I could work on it. I think that b two could be cleaned up a bit. General requirements. We are specifically adding the words the words are page. All accessory buildings we're adding words that require a building permit regardless of size shall comply with all setback requirements. Right? And then it tells how to measure setbacks. I think we need a sentence that says, all accessory buildings that do not require a billing permit are something. And I think what I'm hearing is exempt from setback requirements. May I my is that in there somewhere? I mean, I wanna say accessory buildings that were added to works that require a building permit shall comply with setback. But I'm not reading anywhere that says buildings that don't require a building permit are exempt from setback requirements.

But I mean, the section above it you're right. It doesn't say they don't. Mhmm. But the section above also states kinda defines it further that this is when you do need a building permit. And then it says, well, if you'd and those those that do also need to meet setback requirements. They you could you could add a statement that says if they don't, then then they don't require to meet setbacks. Let's see here. It does say all access item six says all accessory buildings, regardless of size or permanent, shall not be built within the minimum front yard setback area of the principal building.

Right. So Why do we have to

talk to here? So I'm really excited.

It's not all setbacks. It's the front they still wanted to keep the front yard. Okay.

We need to define them. I'm thinking about where we were with code enforcement, and I'm trying to think about a code enforcement officer that's supposed to enforce this code. Right? And I think we need to be as clear as possible for that officer that says, if it doesn't require a building permit, these setbacks are waived, and these setbacks are and if it does require a building permit, then none of the setbacks are waived.

Yeah. I think you could have a a sentence on item two that

that clarifies that. Something like that. And in fact, the last sentence of b two I mean, we're talking about in this so far, we're talking about in this paragraph, all accessory billings that require a billing permit. I assume the last sentence applies to accessory buildings that require a building permit. In no case shall any portion of the building be located within one foot of an of an adjacent lot. Was that accessory buildings that require a building permit or accessory buildings that don't require a building rent or both? I think it's intended to be

those that require a building permit. So maybe one suggestion I would say is to have a section that says accessory buildings that require a building permit.

Exactly. Everything. Except accessory buildings that do not require a building permit. What I'm saying, Pete. I will just go. Yeah. Yeah. That's what I'm saying.

I think if if the council's okay with that, I think staff could draft something that doesn't change any anything here, any any policy, but just clarify it. We can take a stab at it or

if if you want. I'm completely different than that. Okay.

Right. Yeah. Thanks for clarifying for.

Let me ask you about height on non building permitted

accessory buildings.

So we're getting rid of the setback requirement on, say, a side yard, but that means someone can put up a 15 foot accessory building on the lot line.

14 feet and 11 inches, I guess. But yeah.

So no. It's just less than 15 feet. Okay.

Yeah.

So maybe In excess. Okay. 15 feet. There we go. That's okay.

You know? Now that's gonna be a pretty weird building because it's a 100 it's 200 square feet, something like 16 by twelve, sixteen and two thirds by twelve, and eighteen feet no. 15 feet tall. I mean, it's gonna be taller probably than it is wide, which is kinda silly, but somebody will do it.

Okay. Yeah. And I think I think the planning commission discussed that a little bit of whether that was a problem, but

they they didn't see. But yeah. How you guys think about it? Should there be a height restriction on non permit required accessory structures that are in the setback?

They got keys for that.

What's in the rest of that table? I keep trying to deny it. It's it's not there. This table? There it is. How come I can get

I think there are there are columns that was

Oh, yeah. It is. I think yeah. It's yeah. Yeah. There's no changes there, but but, yeah, I can It won't be.

Mhmm.

But that, I believe, has a column of back front.

It does. Yeah. It does. Is it 50 feet? It's twenty and thirty. It's twenty and thirty. It's if it's over I think if it's three if it's three quarters of an acre or greater, it's 30. If it's less than three quarters, it's 20.

So, again, the thing I'm asking the council to think about is an accessory building that's on the lot line that's 15 feet tall. Just can't put a window

That's the ceiling. That's 15 feet tall.

About Twelve thirty from floor ceiling. Twelve

thirty. Twelve thirty. Four thirty. Four thirty. Yeah. Yeah. Nick.

Nick, I mean, in reality, the discussion gives me could potentially be great. Maybe the confrontation, like, hey. You're killing my garden now because I can't get something. You know what I mean? Yeah. That could be a real thing that we fix.

I mean, the side yard setback is pretty small anyway. Yeah. Yeah. It could still create a shade problem for your neighbor. But when it's right on the lot line I mean, I kind of envision a nonpermitted accessory. I don't mean not permitted. I mean, an accessory building that doesn't require a building that's right on the lot line. Shouldn't be a lot taller than, you know, the fence. Maybe a little taller. You know? I look at a eight and twelve pitch on

12 feet, and that's that's, like, 12 feet tall. Yeah. I think 10 to 12 feet is pretty common at the 10 to 12. Yeah.

Yeah. So maybe you could talk about maybe you could maybe put something some words in without knowing the height accessory building height on non building permit required building so maximum.

Or maybe it's only if it's in the setback. I don't know. Do you want me to do it, or do you wanna take a stab at it? I don't I don't really know where to Right. Not not the ones that I reviewed. I I think I think the reason why the the building permit is practical is because that's kind of the line in the sand of when you start getting permits. And if if we try to do things outside of that, it just becomes more difficult to enforce. Yeah. So so you could if if you want to if you wanna stick and another another way to do this is to keep the restrictions but require an just require an accessory building permit for all buildings, including shed you know, including small sheds. You could do that. The planning that's not what the planning commission recommend is. Security. And Yeah. Yeah. You you could do that. There'd be a lot of them, and there'd probably be a lot that wouldn't even apply. They would just put their shed back there. But we could catch some issues if we ask residents to get a permit. If if you wanna if you wanna keep those restrictions, for sure. I would say that if you do wanna keep them, that would be a good course of action to to make sure that we don't run into the issue we have now, which is just a lot of noncompliant structures.

So along those lines, I'm feeling like our space requirements chart should be modified to spell out these things like nonbuilding permit required accessory buildings. This should be this should be listed right in that table with the set what setbacks are enforced and what setbacks are not enforced. Because right now, the spaCy chart just says accessory buildings. Right? And then we have words that say, well, you can put them in the in some setbacks, but not all setbacks. I I jumped ahead on the no charge code review for not in Excel and permitted access to focus. We're not waiting on that.

Levi makes a good point. Yeah. Yeah. It was considered I don't I don't think it's necessary if this code's adopted. I think it's only necessary if if we keep those restrictions. Yeah. I mean, it would it would we would basically be asking, is it in the front yard or the backyard?

Maybe. No. Maybe have no. And maybe well,

how oh, if you wanna add that. Again, that's another restriction. But if you wanna add more restrictions, then, yeah, we can ask those questions. We wanna try to enforce that. We've we've found that our current what we currently do is is is not sufficiently ensuring that there's that these structures are compliant with our code because we have a lot of noncompliant ones. So we're also trying to be realistic of what we can actually what what is actually enforceable.

Next, for rewording. So you guys have more on training stuff? But I managed to rewording on b four.

You know?

And, again, if you want me to take crack at it, that's fine. You can. I mean, my only my only accessory buildings and structures which require a building permit shall be located outside of all public utility easements or other restrictive easements. I think the next sentence should start with accessory buildings and structures, which do not require a building permit, are made approach into the public or other utility easement as long as it's on the ground with movable skids. So, again, we're kinda going from here's here's what you need if you're if if you need a building permit, and here's what you can do if you don't need a building permit. And so It's just it's just phrasing that a little differently? Reordering the unless placed on the ground or removable skids. Just move from accessory buildings that require building permit, this applies. Accessory buildings that do not instead of putting that at the end of the sentence at all. Yeah.

We also have an agreement with company that we it basically forces us to pretending the reason. So in there, we don't allow fences or anything else in the within this agreement. So

unless we're gonna change that agreement, I think our crew could probably mention that somehow. Yeah. We could we could we could reference because there is there is a provision of the code that speaks to safety and maintenance of conveyance. We could reference that as an exception

Okay. Of encroaching on an easement. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, part of the problems our citizens had was they wanted to go to one place in the code. They thought they did, but they didn't say anything about fire. We talked about fire. Didn't say anything about easements, but everyone knows you don't put anything in an easement. Right?

Yeah. I mean, the issue is we there's not gonna be one place in code that we cover everything. But we At least that's

a state code

that protects those easements. And then what he says is that owner is responsible need to go through that easement. So someone can come in that's that has rights to that public utility and just tear that thing down and not have to replace it. Now service improvements and things, those are different. Like, someone put in a driveway over, the that public utility is required to repair that and score those service improvements, landscaping, patios, things like that with regard to structures. It's at risk by the property. But

and so I I I mean, I think that's a great point. And I think where citizens got lost on this process was not knowing that and not having anything in our code that says, hey. There's other requirements that we're not listing here. One of which is easements and maybe reference state code. Because they don't. They don't look at their plat. And if they put a billing not I mean, our code, this proposed code does say you can put a nonbuilding permit accessory structure in the if it's on skids. Right? But sounds like state code says if somebody's if a contractor's in a hurry, a utility provider's in a hurry, it's on skids. They they can just tear it down. Yes.

Yeah. I don't know anyone that would. I mean, most people do an Android build. They'll If it was a gas leak underneath that, Pete That's your point.

They might just be Oh,

what, Ben?

What about it? What does that mean?

No.

Or

We brought that up. Yeah. You're talking about that. Yeah. We brought that up, and they didn't they're like, yeah. Let's handle that at another time. But that's that was one that's one of the complaints that we've received from people. We we frequently get people saying that they wanna put up a stand or something, and we have to tell them no. Yeah. If it's if it's a if it's a if it can be considered a building or structure, no. You

you you you might I was gonna ask about.

I don't know about that one.

Maybe some chats.

Yeah.

What what's that table for future discussion? Or do we Yeah. I mean, they just said,

let's handle that at another point. Let's try to separate the variables and, yeah, they they just said, let's not try to tackle every

issue under the sun here. So where do we stand? Somebody put a stand. Right?

Could just get you could just do away with it altogether and say, if you don't if you don't require if it doesn't require a billing permit

You're what we want. Yeah. Let me let me tell you how dumb I was when we built the house. I looked at our plat, and I saw these dotted lines drawn on the plat. And I thought that meant I couldn't put anything. Those were setbacks, front yard setbacks on sweeping border. I set our fence back. I thought it was the front yard setback. So the dogs who lost out on some passion. What do you get?

Question. I would question to the Kent. Do we how do we feel about just add lots scaled down? Same. Right? It just seems fairly obvious that height should scale down with the lots because I just feel like it would look weird, six, seven thousand square foot lot, 15 foot shed. Mhmm. But should we just scale it down proportionally as lots get smaller, height gets more restricted? Just just to proportionally make sense.

Yeah. So the land use chart scales with lot size. Maybe if we add smaller Yeah. Lot sizes we had in Nepal. Yeah.

Just saying, smaller you go, the shorter it's gotta be.

That's not the way they do it with Hong Kong. Because we don't wanna be Hong Kong.

Yeah. I mean, this chart does it, but maybe and and I sorry. I can't get the last column. But it's it's basically 20 feet up until any anything up to three quarters of an acre is 20 feet, and then over three quarters of an acre is 30 feet. If you wanna get more fine grain than that, you can add more numbers there. Yeah.

12 feet wide with a a 12 pitch. So I think that's 12 feet. I figured it out at about 12 feet. It's not it's not in a set. Right? Yeah. I looked to go to pasture. Behind the front. That's huge.

Yeah. I'd love to bounce. Two notes.

Yeah. Does that give you enough?

I've got a lot of sketchy notes that hopefully I can interpret. Last year.

We did.

Try to make Levi's full time.

That's. Yeah. I mean,

I won't make you should keep it as simple as it does require a really bad I mean, I'm in the house,

and it's not over a survival. You're good.

That's very easy and to interpret.

Yeah.

Okay. Not about simplifying code, and then we get into this. Well backup will be easy again. I'm gonna suggest that it wasn't just a simplified code, but it was to be clear about what we're going to enforce. Right? I mean, simpler is easier to enforce. I agree. But, I mean, if if it's so simple, it's not specific enough, then it's hard to enforce.

You make a good point.

Yeah. I think I think we're staff was in drafting this was looking at our existing code and and making amendments. We could revamp it a little more, make it simpler to interpret rather than go off of the framework that we already have. That's that's really what we were just amending that framework more than revamping it to say exactly what we wanted to say.

Well, how about if this patch is for first reading? I invite with any member of council. Work with Levi, but it's your impression. And I will certainly avail myself to that if you're interested. Yep. And I should have looked this up before, but since we're talking about accessory rebuildings and accessory structures, I have to add and tense. I have to ask, what is a yurt? Don't know.

Go ahead. It requires a building permit. An accessory structure, but in your case, it's a primary structure.

It's temporary. It will be temporary in in nature. Have you talked about like, large city case. Yeah. Let's call them that membrane structure. Okay. So Yeah.

Can I can I clarify something with that direction? I see the mic. Oh, I've got it. I think if if everyone's okay with that, I think staff will focus on kinda organizational changes to the to the wording, but not necessarily changes to policy. So these things about Yeah. Height and and different and diff different setbacks, we'll probably leave that for a second reading for the council to discuss. But if if it's just kind of reorganizing, making it simpler to read, that's probably what we'll focus on.

Yeah. And then if for our next meeting, you you know, first, you'll look at the package and see what's there, and you can certainly bring forward amendments in second grade. Alright. We created a vote on this to the first reading. Looks like we are close in favor of adopting this for first greeting. Please say aye. Aye. Can you post?

K. Passes. Thanks.

How in the world did we make Chet stay this long? Are you serious? I tried to give you a chance right at the beginning of the meeting at at the end. You know, give a little report, but you're right. Chad, thank you for your patience. Yeah. We'll give a little report. So

Do you need anything on the screen, Chad?

No. We

Can we get you some water snack if you can Hold on. Thank you. Let's have item 11. This is accepting a contractor and consolidate paving concrete for nickel, chip, and seal. Do you want me to Projects.

Chet, thank you for being here. Take it away. It's all yours. Yeah. You can also for listening to us. And this has been my effort with the team, first Steven Tom, so they chime in and so forth. So what we do is every year, we we get a payment program. We've been running on the streets. And this year, they had a lot of two with their program for shipments through all are are still inroads. So it consists of thirty two hundred and twelve and twenty six hundred. Mhmm. Basically, the matter of the 12 and 3,200. But we Yes. 2,600. 2,600 actually has been treated all year. So and our discussion wouldn't want to treat we have for any or two year road. Yeah. The best solution that pulls up longer and the staff. So what we did in regards to the call here, what is but we did go just to 500 less interest 200 because that's what the program did state. We've had kind of with this change order. And this with our budget, we go through actually how we get our money through the assets. So that just fluctuate a little bit. So we did I reached a close to a contractor, and he gave us another bit of a change that was a bit biased. Gotcha. And we feel like that's gonna be the best option in Melbourne just because chips and contractors, they like big front keys. They have to come back

or just buy a lot. It's gonna be really expensive per city.

There's a there's a whole mod fee. Have a lot of trucks, equipment, things like that. So good. That's that's the best thing. I think what we've done is most of the time, cities in Canada still have the half inch chip. We decided to go with the three inch chip with a smaller four five hundred eight. And also to

sure you can ask this question.

It's about 100 West. You know, shipping that visiting. So just just say, you know, it'll get you in all the different food.

Thank you. Yeah. Thank you.

I hate those chips.

One one that I know of the sales sales, The rules will

be shut down the period of time off of all the year. So

in this contract, the contract to take care of everything. And then if you maybe do tell them maybe work around the parent's base for school. So everything would have they're paying for sports school, and they will wait to help the parent space.

Yeah.

In the storm suite, if you guys have questions, please let me let me know if you can answer them. This is my first time so far. So please advise if we please let me so

Well, they against.

So

that's a staggering amount.

That is we have a it's last year we did. Just a little bit.

So,

yeah, with this program, it's just something like, beforehand, you have big roads, and all of us are scared. There's someone that comes scared. And with all the trainings I've been to, they've always said to keep your good roads good. These are great roads.

So like I said before,

the reason why we did choose to end up five five hundred lots is we don't always have any calls here or the year after the number. Exactly. We have a we're still set because we know what's our biggest expense in city.

Yep.

Did does Cache County bid on these? I hear we Like, the county sometimes contracts with cities to do these things. Do they happen to be able

to They did not. Okay. So they just want We we gave each other exactly.

Oh, thank you. Well, you can stay on the hot seat while we chat about it. Okay. But, Mike, thanks. Counsel, it's up to you. So this is to accept no. This is the accept of a contractor. Item 11. Okay. We have a motion from eight, a second from oh, Aaron, thank you. To approve contractor and what do I say? Paving and concrete, chicken seal, road maintenance. Here we go. Paving and the contractor and the road maintenance project including the change order

Yeah. That may have us. So is the change order certain, or that's just if we need it?

That is not included. Maybe it's called the.

We prefer it. Yes. So it could be $5.85, but it could be a little.

Yes. But I think it'll be a long run-in the floor and be more expensive.

So if you do come back with five blocks, it'd be expensive.

No. Two of this question I haven't seen anybody. It feels like they didn't answer. When a resident comes up to me and says, why are we reselling what we've already done before? And the road is just barely built. You know, it was poorly built by someone else. Why are we doing these roads out on the agenda? Feels like those are the only roads we do. My answer should be, well, we've done studies.

We've used this, what's called, March In Farm Street. Farm Street.

And these are the roads that identified that we should

do as far as the machine. Is that my answer?

Penguin, thanks.

You might add, in this case, these are the main roads that get the most bad, which can wear it quicker. It it's more often than you have to do.

I mean, I didn't feel the tension to this one. As as you see, the city's growing crazy in this case. So it's more better for the heavy traffic and traction. Also, the traction,

I know that the roundabouts are somewhat new in the area, snow, things like that. So that would take a little bit for for traction, big operation.

I mean, it sorry. Is it fair to say that this is just, like, a little bit of I mean, I know this is a big one for but, like, just in the context of some preventative maintenance, it was a lot longer than

having to be do. So, usually, we totally say preservation, important remedial rotation. It's

it's a single, and that's why we have this program.

K. So there's a couple of mixed opinions out there as well on the treatment. You mentioned brand new roadwork treatment. There there's a couple ways that that a new city looks at it as well. So on every brand new sub division that just lays their their asphalt down, Staff works for that contract, close the road to all developer in in their subcontractors, and we have that treated right away. We put that first treatment on before there's any track there. So that's helped that helped keep everything concealed in. And that that so it's important to get that first treatment as soon as you can. The another opinion by silence of this mix is wait one year if we put that first treatment on. And in in the case of Co op West, that's where we've waited that year. It's now complete, and and the program is also recommending that treatment as well. So and as and three algorithms and forecast and things. Each road in Newbury City right now, it degrades at a certain degree through this program based on the traffic in different roads. Once it reaches this degradation and a pager rating, in this case, there's another reason to grade it as well. Once it reaches, like, a six or seven, it recommends that treatment. The the it's just automated in this asset

and so they keep from When we first implemented Inform Streets, the streets yes. We put in data now. So we're asked to

Yes.

Mhmm. Yeah. We went down.

We drove it there. We're finding the the app mechanic.

Assess all of our our most daily events.

Don't mind, Larry. Okay. Let's call Larry back to you. Yeah. We're probably not a data on the road that have been sitting. I mean, we have spreadsheets probably goes by up to twenty ten. And that information is That information is all. But I don't know that they really took that much much of that information because they're welcome. I hate the rating on match and read. Yeah. It's really good. Drive every road and and visually inspect it and then mock their own even though we treated this or we decided it four years ago, five years, five years ago, they're saying today to treat it. Thanks. I like Kent's quote. It's less expensive to defeat good roads good than it is to let good roads go bad and.

Yeah. And the the study shows that we do, they rather than live experience these twenty years. We just can't afford to do.

Before and if you don't do anything, you replace it in twenty years. I don't know if you stay up

with treatments and all that. It's indefinite. Right. Yeah. No. The the trains are going to be sitting here trying to be, like, years. Oh, it's long. Longer competitive.

And

and before before this, I'll mention that we the program we've been a better with the new developers, I'm excited for because when we say we've made the developer pay around a 110,000 in two years. And you just kinda see with

as as the side of it gets built, first thing is the road.

It's really hard to get the oil off, but still get rid of it. So I'm excited to see along and how well we do compared to our prior to it. Would that be soon?

Nick? Just just because I I I don't know if I need to ask. We already have the budget for this thing, essentially, through that we don't have to move any money from John or Brian or anything to

No. There is definitely money on the budget you will be imposing. Includes? Yeah. So this is kinda for fiscal year twenty six point seven. This is for next fiscal year, which is why we're not cut a check before June or July.

So we would be asking we already have some already potentially to allocate this.

If off of memory, there's about there's a lot of money. There's, like, a few million dollars sitting in that phone, and that phone comes from gas taxes. Yeah. So we sit there, they get they will go to the pump, they pay the gas tax, goes to state, turnaround, gives it back to us. We do a good job. That's based on lane miles in the city and some other black box stuff. So we make sure everything is up to date with them to make sure we get the most amount of money back from them. And there's been some weird, like, adjustments in the last couple of years where we've got quite a bit more than we have in the past. We don't anticipate that that would continue. But like I said, because of that, there's about $2,000,000 in the fund right now today. So this spend 600 of it. That's clear. Yep. And, you know, we expect to get anywhere from three to four next year.

Three to four 100.

To 400. That's you've seen revenue from. Hey. You're jumping ahead. That's item 13.

Yes.

Okay. That's good.

We get it.

So, essentially, our vote is to set the contractor for to find the project that we're gonna discuss later. Okay. Good point. Okay.

I'm

not clear. Is the the motion on the table now to award the original base bid and the change order? Yeah.

Yes. So it's accepting the contractor and awarding the money for the project, including the including the change order.

Yeah.

That kinda steers your budget discussion later on.

Yeah.

But, I mean,

even though it's later tonight, it we're not cutting any checks until the final budget's stopped by June 30 or something before July is my Right? Maybe.

Got a question. Maybe. The traffic control piece, what I read in the dish, allows our engineer to decide we like what they're doing. Does that care?

Yes. They'll submit a plan to me or review it and add questions. I have the opportunity to ask questions to them or make recommendations.

Thanks. And this is this is traffic control during

this project. Correct. It's not Detours. Seeing

not picking a scab. It's not putting anything new in the road. It's not already there. It's not trying to do the chips that'll road to build suppliers. As long as the chips on the road, you can drive on. Yeah.

Do speech. I hope so.

There's mainline and oil line and process, people can cross even the hot flyers.

That's one view. I didn't get it. So so That's good.

K. Great. K. Council,

I'll take you to clean. Well, my last four of them.

So I should figure this out beforehand. Do we need a voice vote on this or just oral voice or roll call? K. So those in favor of accepting this contractor and approving this project for road maintenance, Please say aye. Aye.

K. That's a fantastic. Yep.

Thanks, Chad. Good job.

And

we need to talk about item 12, which is still on the agenda. Is that you, Chad?

It's gonna be.

Tom. Chad, you're you're my hero. Thank you for coming in and staying hanging with us. Tom, will you lead us into an item 12 contract with Brian Johnson?

Leave it. And I'll preface this by saying that last agenda item shows that acceptance of a contract with consolidated pay. So my mistake, I I drafted that. Are you clear on what we adopted? I am. Hopefully, yes. But I I started with the drug. Should've said contract with the except the contractor working in I still have struggle. So this one's a so we're we're look at me. We have a contract with with me and Johnson construction company with construction of some sidewalk from Nibley Middle School.

Excuse me. Nibley Elementary School. Main entrance on the south

that will be between nine foot and 10 foot wide. It will go from that entrance to the south all the way to 800 West. What's happening is these kids will entertain out of school, especially in the afternoon. It's like this giant platoon. They're all over the place. There's no real park there. There's no mud hole. No curve and gutter. We're really applying things. So we're maximizing the right of way that we had, and and in some cases, we had to narrow that down to near nine feet as we went through that core section. It includes curb and gutter. It includes some drainage because the swell's no longer gonna be there and some light in there. So this this whole contract in the bid, we we advertised in the newspaper. It was We had

seven responses.

One of them was not read at the public bid opening because they failed to include the addendum that was issued to the bidding process. And the bid numbers were between the low bid was a $176,182 in a 1¢, and went up to 370,000 ish. LeGrande Johnson is that low bid. We'd like to award that contract with them. They'll start work no sooner than when school gets out, so June 1. And it this project, assuming we don't run into any utility complex when we run-in when we're installing the storm drain pipe, The contract that we completed by before the beginning of school, some little touch up items like landscape restoration stuff, maybe overlapping the school session. We feel that LeGrande Johnson and the data is qualified to do the work, and they've they've sent a schedule that matches what we we need in this.

Yep. Great. And it's actually

It is this it it didn't budget in this fiscal year. So I'm gonna this just made that it actually came in under under my estimated value. That was in the 5,300,000 range in that upper end. So but we had really wanted this project to have work with this suit this estimator on other projects. So we can put each other to use the screen. I'll I'll make mention also that Justin is I assigned Justin as the public information guy. So he says, Justin, you you go talk to these people, tell them what's coming, show them the plans, get some input from them. And he's done. So he he he made a temp. I don't think he's he's talked with everybody. They know that the project's coming.

There's there's no right of way acquisition.

No right of way. No problem. So I mentioned that we've utilized the existing right of way, and we've narrowed the the sidewalk. It it varies, like, nine to 10 feet wherever we have the room. And it still gives a little bit of room between them probably, so we're not encroaching to Yeah. We're holding where the back of sidewalk is now. So we're in to park strip. Yeah. So there will be no park that we could have gotten any sidewalk to be right in for.

Cut down a lot of trees? No. You're working with Sure. Sorry. The the school, principal king, they're all they're all on board with this. Yes. They've communicated with her.

Okay. Counsel? We need a motion to approve.

Motion to motion from Nate, a second from Nick to approve accept the contract for this work. Discussion? Garrett, I can see you got it. No. I just heard. Yeah. I mean, they vary that much. It's not.

It's not in the middle. Okay. I would have hit the bigger one. So you'll see a variation in this, but you'll also see a variation in the size of the company. The big three, I call it, you're gonna be something for or something core. I think they have them now. There's stake reports. There's look at Dan Johnson and and non typical. So it it as long as those guys are in the same range, you know, you the issue is pretty pretty good. These are the ones they just haven't been they don't have a whole lot of experience in municipal. You know, maybe they just say, hey. I'm gonna fill out this huge number. A huge number out hoping that no one will spares that he respects. So that was put in contracts and then even on here and says, if it is beyond our budget, we have to write not to go for the project.

That's a great question, Aaron?

So the corner right on 2608 West, We're just doing a a normal corner then with any sort of rollouts or anything.

No. We're just gonna tie in, you know, like, six feet of the curb and repouring that curb on there and just matching where it's existing now. Yeah. Oh, I I didn't mention we're gonna get a flashing stop sign, just the red flashing. Both on both sides of eight plus? Just this one for now. It's just in the budget, a few more for the places as we with locations that we can terminate here, but that's that's the next agenda.

So a red flashing stop sign on the Northeast Corner

of The Northeast Corner for West Africa. Yes. For West Africa.

Yep. Yep. Yep. Got it.

Hey, Nathan.

I'm looking at the the project plans, but I'm not an engineer. Awesome.

Then why are you looking at the plan?

Plan?

Plan specifically. It's right where this used to be trying to be, like

I'm tensioning running. It just turned in mud.

How how help me understand what's below what we're doing, or is it trying to shift it back to the where was that in the market? Oh, very good question. There was a lot actually, a lot of discussion with the

on that exact the we're trying to balance the slope of the room that sheds the water to the curb and then gets in that gutter. And then that that running slope of the curve has to get into a catch basin and then to apply to an existing system or, you know, to pipe it forever till day when it's ready. In this case, there's there is an existing catch basin on the north side, and we'd be I we're gonna remove that box and replace it with a new bigger and then extend some piping westward, and everything's gonna be collected. And if you look right near the first on the hot section of the profile of your Right. Plan there. Right? There there's we do need they they graded this the running slope of the curb to go into a catch basin right near there, right near the. And then from there, the water is going to go into the pipe, and it's gonna go to the east and then attach to that one catch basin that we're removing and placing. And from there, it continues on towards the school and ends up going back to their parking lot and on and on through Apple Creek and Yeah. Creek and and beyond. So the water's gonna flow east? It will be flowing east until it hits the the earth. Sorry for the long that's actually variable. Okay.

But is it gonna go uphill or downhill?

In this case, it's gravity's gonna yeah. I see what you're saying, though, because I do see that piping and it's coming from south, and that that actually goes through Harrisburg. You can't park in there. So it it it is a my understanding is it's a combined stormwater and canal.

In Clear Creek?

Through this whole section, it comes through the the park and everything. We check flow and there's a passing by I did do you have to dig in for this

sidewalk and all the strange stuff in. I'll let I'll I'll see those projects together. So the high beam

is a it's a small one. It's a 12 inch. We want one foot to cover from the top of the asphalt to the top of the pipe, and then there'll be at least six or eight inches of bedding underneath that pipe. So you're three feet ish. Where this where the sidewalk is, you just have to scrape down to get through the vegetation. And then and most likely, we we tried to match what was there just so it's not encroaching, and we're not having to do a whole lot of landscape repair. But around the the sidewalk, it'll probably be an eight or nine inch excavation, then they bring in four inches of gravel, and then they pour the sidewalk on top. And then this the curve itself on the backside of the curve, curve sticks up six inches, but it also goes down six is six inches in the ground. And so that's 12 inches, and then underneath that is four to eight inches of gravel. And then where we're doing the road pavement, we're gonna have 12 inches of pit run, which is a a structural fill underneath. I can't remember, but it's four or six inches of base course and then four inches of asphalt. So right in there is probably your deepest around 2.43213. Aside from the pipe. Is there a concern you have?

There's a random pipe to use. It's about $7.65

with us today. That's

the. But I think he he went ahead and it went through. It goes to the north. Yeah. It came as where the school is then outside. The bad being of $7.65

was.

That's next to it on the very west side and turn

down in the road. I think it here, but it was never used for anything. He just got put in.

Someone someone didn't mention that. Was it? Yes. Who else?

Probably. Parents.

Keith. Yes. I met him. He he described it. Yes.

We'll we'll probably find out.

I'm talking about my dog.

She's

She's she's further back now.

Let's do it. In a scenario?

Sorry. I was just.

Thank you. No problem. Alright. We have a motion and a second, I believe. We need a second on the motion to consent. Those in favor, please say aye. Aye. May I close? Hey. Thank you, Tom. Thanks. Passes unanimously. I'm going to propose

a short break. Yeah. Before

we get into it soon. Something we hope you'll really Yeah. No. I don't think we heard you. We'll call this meeting back order. We do have a forum. We'll go ahead. Okay. Take it outside.

Okay. Cool.

And I don't wanna read any of what's published on the agenda because it's so long to satisfy truth and taxation sorts of things that I'm just going to say, let's move along with item 13, discussion and consideration of resolution twenty six ten. And, Cheryl, you make sure that Justin says everything he's supposed to say, disclose this. And I'm sure Justin will do that all without our help, but I'm not making any help. So he'll help him.

Yeah. So, Lou, if I could, Mayor, maybe just take a second. And, typically, what would happen in previous years, this this council needed to be a workshop, and we would just openly discuss the budget, talk about things that may or may not happen in the final budget, things that you would like us to look into. But with recent legislation and the way things have changed, they had passed a lot of group and taxation laws that make an effort to try to get more public involved with the budgeting process. So as you can see, didn't really help us out much, but we appreciate the public being here, and are happy that they would come. And so be here anyway.

Yeah.

So So these items, number 13 all the way to the end of the agenda are basically check boxes. We wanna make sure we hit to meet true and taxation requirements because we don't wanna mess it up. Because last year, there was entities that tried to do true and taxation. They missed an I or they didn't cross the t, and they were denied their tax increase. And so they had to figure out how to function without that extra money that they thought they were going to have. And so we are in a situ unique situation right now with Midlucity and what's going on with potential fire and some other increases and things that we'll get buried into the middle of them in very depth of. But we're kind of on the fence right now whether or not we need to raise taxes. And so we are doing everything we can to be as conservative as possible to make sure that if we need to raise taxes, that we have the ability to do so. And so this budget that is prepared and will be presented to you tonight includes a property tax increase. And I'm gonna get way into the details of that, but I just wanna make that very clear. You're probably gonna hear that 15 times tonight, and we have specific agenda items to make sure we have an x. Schedule of impacts of what that tax increase would mean. But, again, we're gonna we're gonna get into all those details, and I can talk to you about this budget until well past midnight if you'd like me to. I'm going to try to give the speed version tonight given the fact that we don't have a lot of public here. Just make sure I get all of your questions, make sure you understand. So I'm gonna try to go through as fast as I can, but please know if you have any questions, any concerns, anything you wanna stop me, please just stop mid sentence, whatever you need to do to make sure that you get the information that you need. So tonight is the what was considered the tentative budget that will need to be passed by resolutions just by not adopt a final. Anything you say tonight or adopting this tentative budget can be amended and changed in future meetings. So we're going to, hopefully, pass a resolution tonight saying that this is our tentative budget with the tax increase. And on May 28, we will have an official public hearing on the budget, and we will have nothing else on that agenda. Okay. So that'll be your twenty eighth will be a regular meeting. We could have other things on the agenda. We'll talk about it. We'll finalize the budget. But if that finalized budget includes a tax increase, we cannot actually

formally

we can accept the final budget, but we have to have a truth and taxation hearing in August, which is scheduled already. The date slipped in my mind. If you can look that up quick. But at that meeting, we will have the official truth and taxation, again, the public hearing, and have the opportunity to include or not include that tax increase. And that will be a meeting where there will nothing else where there will be no nothing else on the agenda that evening. Thank you. August 27 will be when there's truth in taxation here again. So this is a long process. And the reason that got pushed out to the twenty seventh is because with truth in taxation, anybody that wants to do that in the county has to submit a date and time. The county assessor does some magic to make sure that they don't overlap, that they're all half out of park so that anybody in the county could go to any that's raising taxes that they should choose to do so or not miss a meeting because they're at another one. So that's kinda why it it gets bumped out schedule wise so long. So any any questions there with the schedule? Yeah. So there were laws changed, and that's part of the reason the laws were were changed because a lot of the citizens were feeling like the decision had been made prior to the truth of taxation here. And so now we are required to hold that money in a separate account. If we want to do it through the taxation, we're gonna adopt a budget. We're gonna we're gonna hold that amount of money, and we can't spend that money on the things that we talk about the property tax being used for until that August 27 deadline.

Yes. Yes.

10 to 10 that's being adopted even in the end of June. Yeah. There might be some details there that are a little fuzzy to me that still need to kinda kinda piece out. But that's the gist of it is the public needs to have an opportunity to weigh in at that through the taxation hearing before this we can spend that money. Which I gotta think a little more about as I'm saying that. Interesting. So I I do wanna go through this budget. And, again, I have lots of slides. I will blow through them. Please stop me when you want to stop me. If we could get into work. General use for our budget are the same as every year. We estimate conservatively, so we wanna overestimate our expenses, underestimate our revenues. I've tried really, really hard to narrow this and try to be as close as we can and not overdo this, but we we do wanna be conservative. We look at every single line in this budget every single year. We review it. We make sure we talk about what it is, what it's paying for, what it's not paying for, and assess whether that line needs to be adjusted. There's not any wholesale. Let's pump this department or that by this percentage. We go every every single line. The other thing we work to do is develop a budget that is not dependent on growth. We want we don't wanna be in a situation where we're expecting revenue from growth and we hire people and we build programs and things that people become become necessary dependent on. And when that growth slows down, we lose. And so this is a big reason why in the end, sometimes we have a lot more money than coming in than we projected is because of growth. And we wanna be conservative there, and I'll show you charts and reasons why we did what we did. But But we wanna be conservative in growth and for those statements that I talked about. These are the different funds that the Nibley City budget consists of. So was it 12 or 13 of these things? You can think of these things as individual envelopes where money goes in from different sources. Money goes out for different reasons, but they're very specific reasons and very specific sources. They're not meant to be passed one from the other. So you look at the bottom line Yeah. You know, $22,000,000 doesn't mean we could just go drop $22,000,000 in the water department or whatever. There's very specific reasons behind each fund and what we can and can't do with each fund. So you have to think of them individually, not as a whole. So we're gonna go through all of these and talk about each one of them. And, typically, we just well, this is the chart to just kinda show the percentage wise of the entirety of the budget and each fund.

I don't know. We go through each fund.

This is just, you know, numbers to back up that chart for our overall revenues that we expect. 26,000,000 or so coming into revenue, 26 or so in expenses. We always balance. And that's a it's kind of a unique thing that in the end, I have a little thing that will help explain that. But we always balance revenues and expenses in the musical budget. So we're gonna go through each of the funds. I'm gonna go on a little funny word because general fund's a big one, and it gets a lot of attention and a lot of the discussion. But so I'm kinda starting with the small ones here and working our way up. But this number right here is the number we just talked about with the project that we would like to do with the shipment sale. So the class c fund is money that comes to you from the gas tax. State collects the taxes. State redistributes the taxes. I kinda already know stuff. So we have in this fund, the bulk of it comes from the the the taxes I just mentioned. We also have this new sorts in the last few years where mass transit taxes comes into us. So between those two, that makes up the bulk of the revenue that comes into our into our pockets. Again, we with the program that we have in place to help us spend our money intelligently, we have budgeted 600 and that's a 6. Right? $6.60 or 600? I should have brought my glasses. $6.60. Or I should know the numbers or I should know. But so $660,000 spent this year on those cheap and sealed projects. We also have some paints for we have a railroad audit coming up. We've also had some other discussions about crosswalks and maybe some painting on the East West and some other places that are not included in the big $660,000 project. Couple of other ones in there for to kinda balance out the account and but what I should've started with, class c is used to maintain roadways. It's roadways. We interpret sidewalks as part of that roadways, but we can't go build a park with this money. We can't go within the water system with money. This money is used for collected and used for a purpose. The next slide I wanna talk about is the Municipal Billing Authority. The Municipal Billing Authority is a separate legal entity that is a tool that is used by the city to borrow money to construct buildings. Big drum roll. The loan for this building was paid off this week. So congratulations. You no longer on a dime on this building. Months some months ago, we made the decision or got direction from counsel that when the interest we were paying was higher than the interest we were earning for a consecutive period of three months that we would pay off the building. So that trigger finally happened. We've been waiting a year and a half for that. This flop it finally flopped. We pulled the trigger, and I believe Amy either this check is cut or mailed or very, very close to where it was last week. I can't remember for I think we did an ETA. So I think it's done. I've approved it to be done. It should be done. So this fund basically will go to very little, and there'll be just some some change left over in that fund. We'll leave there just to keep it alive and and and account for it and watch it there, but there shouldn't be any more there's no revenue coming into the fund or no expenses coming out of the fund for this fiscal year. Same with the Community Reinvestment Agency. This is a similar legal entity that exists to create and promote economic development. There was some history with the project. The project has kinda stalled. There's some events in discussions with county on whether this project ever really will happen and if we can use the money, but it's really right now, honestly, just kind of the placeholder sitting there over in future if we want to chase down any economic development, tax increment financing projects to help economic development in the city.

But it's specifically limited to a certain area.

Right? It's very specific. Yeah. It's it's the Malouf data. Yeah. It's it's a project area where it's a project plan. It's it's a very specific I mean, it's studies and books and figures and tax numbers. It's not willy nilly stuff. This is again, history wise, it was the Malouf area, and the idea was the Malouf was gonna invest in the area and increase dramatically the property tax that we obtained. So you take that property tax instead of going to its normal channels would all funnel to the CRA with some small exceptions, and there would just be a bunch of money in the the CRA would be able to control to put back into the area to assist and promote economic development. And so like I said, the the development just hasn't really taken off yet hasn't removed. And so there's some questions about timelines and deadlines been met and some things like that. So we're working through those things, and we'll continue to do so. So so right now, there's no active project

that

we will need to re up and redo things if we want to reignite the project and the project that may come into the city. So, you know, the thing was a project that the CRA was handling. The CRA could potentially look at other project as well. Yep. There's this right now, there's some state reporting requirements. So there's a we moved a little bit of money into the fund to make sure we take care of those reporting requirements, but very small amounts of money. Moving on to our emergency medical services fund. This is a fund that was started about five or six years ago, if I remember right, when Twenty. Sims fell apart, and we contracted that time with Cash County to provide ambulance services to our city. We started the fee. I think it was $656 back then when it started. That fee is down to $5 per month on residents utility bills. So they pay that $5 a month. That goes into this fund. This fund is used to pay Cache County ambulance and the first responders. And they we are currently under contract for which is kinda goofy the way that that per person is, like, $17.39, which is an increase of 3% over last year. Now we're gonna have a lot more discussion about emergency response and medical, but right now, this budget is constructed such that that fee remains in place and that citizens will pay and continue to pay $5 a month towards ambulance service. We'll come back to that. Moving on to the utilities, water funds, we if all intents and purposes are expecting a dry year. So what that means for us is that we're probably gonna sell more water, which in turn increases our power cost. And so we've made that assumption and adjusted those things just a little bit. We made some adjustments to how meters are paid for. We evolved struggled with as new homes are being built, they need a water meter. They pay a water meter fee to cover that water meter, but we have to peg a number in our budget to spend on water meters. And it always really bothered our water division manager that that line would always go over budget. So we kinda split this into two. We took that water meter budget and split it into the meters that are just kind of random replacements because a water meter breaks down and is on an existing home, it's gonna come out of one account. And that can be a pretty planned fixed number. The other one is for new meters. And so we put a money in as our best guess in there, but that may or may not be accurate depending on development. Development might grow, so it might be low. It might be high. But the point is there's a revenue line in the budget to cover that. So if it goes over, it's covered in the revenue. If it's under, we didn't get the revenue. So it's trying to split those two so he can plan a little better and feel better about managing system without going over what he perceived as budget. So, hopefully, that makes sense. We do have some pretty lot of water projects in the works right now. We would like to do a new water master plan, and these things continue to grow and continue to be expensive. So we're budgeting a $150,000 for that water master plan that should set us up next, hopefully, five to eight years on the next projects. Right now, we're in the middle of drilling a well. Right in the middle. We'd like to be further along than we are. We're working through that process, but we're, you know, in the middle of that. So there's some money that will roll roll over for that project. We need to do some rework inside the 4000 South Well House. The soft start is which is a a mechanism that ramps the pump up slowly instead of hammer on. It is a way of making your equipment last longer and and reducing power bills and power demands and things like that. That thing is really just old, frankly. Pretty sure my dad also put that in as I was sitting on a little knobby thing in there, punching holes in the wall. But that needs to happen. There is also in the budget a fair amount of allotment we actually set aside for upsizing with new developments. Now we there's been a lot of room on discussion about potential development at the South South of where we're drilling on a new level. So we'd we wanna plan to be able to pay developers upsize the line because that is substantially cheaper than going in later and putting in a new bigger line. So that money will be budgeted and spent only if those projects move forward and continue. The longer those projects, we can if if they don't happen soon, we will ship more of that money in the future to impact fees as opposed to water fees. But just with where we're at with the new well, we're spending most of our impact fee money now on the new well. We wanna set aside this money for in case those things pull through and actually add them. So there's quite a bit of money for that that, again, may or may not even happen. We have a couple of small projects with some security cameras in the six forty. Those I mean, those are really more operational. They're not so much security, but a way to see what's going on inside there without us happy to drive to the facility. Heating and air conditioning going out in our shops, we're looking to do that. The only big equipment we're talking about is hydraulic saw. This is a saw. One of the dangerous parts of working in the water department is getting into a nasty dirty trench full of water, cold and mucky with a big saw in your hands and your arms trying to cut a 12 to eight inch pipe. This is a safer saw that you actually strap on the pipe. You get it all set up perfectly, and then you push your button and you step back and get out of the way and let the saw do the cutting. And it's just a lot safer and a lot cleaner. So that's really

the only new equipment that we're talking about being water. Comment on upsizing pipes. We've talked about ways to maybe through pioneering agreements, so on and so forth, to have the city of finance upsizing pipes knowing that it's coming, but then developers that are downstream of that would recoup we would recoup those with us. Right? Good point. Yeah. Good point. We're

maybe one other thing besides that I should have said in the very, very beginning about general concepts is we try very, very hard to make sure that development is paid for development and that that is not put in the backs of the citizens. We've that is a core principle that we try to

take every advantage of that we can to people.

This is just the numbers of nuts and bolts of the revenue. Part of the revenue is finalizing the loan that we have been approved for. That loan has not been closed because we are separated the drilling of the well with the construction of the well housing equipment that goes inside the well

or financial

federal loan issues and things like that. So, anyway, that one is still out there. We expect to have that hole done. There's a lot of hole in the ground, literally, the one. It should be done right now in the middle of July. And then and even how that goes, we can either get the house built and equipped in the fall and or maybe early next year, depending on how it goes. But regardless, we are showing the income from that loan in these numbers. The other big number is our water you just the usage fees and the water rates that people pay. That's a big chunk of the revenue that comes in for the system. So we like I said, we're a a little bit still conservative, I think, but we're we've bumped that number up a little bit. There's expenses. Here's where you can see the the water meters was split apart into two. I think that's mostly what we wanted to talk about there, the water numbers moving on to the sewer. One thing that's a little different, there wasn't a lot of money before. We used to get a little bit of money from the have them on their own system and pump it higher so we don't receive any money from them. One of the big big tickets in the sewer fund is the vac truck. It is a super incredible piece of equipment that and it it really is vital for not on the sewer, but the water department. Is used off the car for lots of different things. But the problem with the back truck is everybody know what I'm talking about? The big truck with a big tank, the vacuum tube that sucks. Sucks. Yeah. Sucks sucks a lot. We use it to clean the pipes. We use it to excavate sticky situations where a backbone would cause damage to other utilities and things like that. And it is, like like I said, amazing piece of equipment, but it takes a little bit. It is expensive to maintain. And what we're trying to do is get the maximum value out of that thing and let sell it at the point where it's about to start losing the funds of value to just maximize our dollar there. And so we have some triggers set points set where if we can get, I think, $300,000

for our current backdrop

and we could buy a new one for $600,000, then we will pull that trigger. But that's the way it's budgeted right now. Please.

We've bought it one.

Yeah. It's $3.03.

Yeah. It's 2 or three. Yeah.

Well, there's 600 now. Yeah. So, you know, we think roughly a $100 a year, probably. But if we can't get that, yeah, we can pull the trigger on that if we don't hit those set points. And at that point, what that means is we just we look at it again on a year to year basis and try to estimate where we think that is and where we get the most out of it. If we can't, then we just we just keep moving. I mean, it'll last a long time, but we're trying to figure out that right sweet spot to get rid of it before we start running into some of the major issues, the maintenance issues that come up with those trucks and switching out and getting the newer one to avoid those costs. Are there not any sort of contractors that

that have gone out and bought back trucks and and just offer services to cities for this kind of day, back truck services?

They are, but they're I guess how I'd answer that is it would probably just not be cost effective. We use the same all the time for lots of things. So so we we can look into that. We used to do that, but we paid close to 60 to $80,000 a year to have somebody come out just to clean. That that's just to clean, not not to excavate. What else do we deal with that? Any size excavating?

But you said to pay a $100,000

a year of maintenance.

No. It's a $100,000 value, like, what it would cost you. Right? But that was what I'm saying. It's $80,000 just to clean. We use it way more than cleaning all the time for different things, cleaning out. That was just sewer. You know? We haven't we we didn't need to clean storm drain lines in previous years. So we clean a lot more than we used to clean. We use it for lots of other things, I guess, if all I can say. I mean, it is an expensive piece of equipment and but it is super handy and kind of the the backbone of our water and sewer department. So, again, we just wanna make sure we're getting the most value, trying to figure out the sweet spot on making it as cost effective as we can. So we can talk way more about that if you'd like in the future. I mean, I can try to pull some numbers. Comes up. I mean, we can just pull up there. There's a maintenance cost keeping it till it's extended fly versus Yeah. Leasing it. Yeah. And that that is being talked about that. We're okay with that. We continue to do that based on these metrics that I I can't tell you off the top of my head what they are. We're paying with that if that's what financially turns out to happen. I'm sure it makes sense. Now, for example, I think the reason we sold the one we have and bought the one we did is because someone offered us a really good price on the one we had. It happens to still be in the valley, so we know where it is. And if we need it, we can we can go get it. So we thought that was a good reason to the two together was a good reason to to move it.

So,

yeah, it's a big expense for sure. Some smaller projects, I believe, in the wet well, it wasn't a pretty scientific way of trying to move the air inside your lift station wet well to decrease the amount of grease that builds up and sticks to equipment and causes problems. And so there there are blowers, the fan, and filters, and things that that really help bring down the amount of maintenance and amount of work here and equipment. Things like that. So there's also more storage. It seems like every year, we're gonna our public works are starting to look like a shipping bar, ripping out of storage containers. I don't think we've had to go too high yet. There's quite a few of those down there. We'd like some more of those. What we'd think we'd like to do is put more replace some cement collars around the manholes. You'll see in the motorways, you'll see manholes and water valves. They've got concrete piling around them to try to keep the drive surface smooth for drivers that get beat up and then we replace it. And there's that heating and air conditioning for the shop again. We split that between the water and sewer. And the only real big projects in the sewer right now is similar to the water when you put some water money, excuse me, sign it for offsets if and when developers come in. So excuse me. Any more questions with sewer? Here's just kinda the numbers. Stonewall are summary. This is one of the asks in the budget is to hire an additional full time employee. We've been putting this off for two or three years, and, honestly, I would probably do it again given the current situation if we didn't have what we believe to be a fantastic employee right now with us. He's part time. He's looking for full time, and we would love to keep him and believe that he it would be a great investment and be great to keep around. So we are looking and asking in this budget for authorization to hire another full time employee, which would be split between the stormwater fund and the streets department fund, which the streets department fund is part of the general fund, or I should say the streets department in the general fund. So this employee will be funded in those two places, which will come up again as we talk about the general fund, street treating taxation here in a minute. The other thing in the storm is a project to do some modifications to the summer it used to be sunrise. It's called Discovery Park now where the Frisbee Gulf opened the stormwater ponds off the Park West. Those are pretty big ponds, and they're kind of the bottom of the building. A lot of people drains through those ponds and past those ponds. And one of the things identified in our stormwater master plan was the need to upsize piping to get water out of these ponds and get it north into the slough on the other side of the highway. But we can avoid a bunch of money and a bunch of effort by upsizing those pipes if we can hold more water and retain more water in those ponds and in the wetland that exists around those ponds. So we we're looking at trying to maximize the amount of storage we can put in those pond to eliminate the need to spend all that money on those bigger pipes. So that involves maybe raising sidewalk here or there or doing some things, but pretty minimal cost. I think 50,000, if I remember right. Let's say 50,000. Yeah. Capital outlay improvements right there. 50,000 on our end right there. So that's really the base expense in the the stormwater bond. K. So now we're moving into our impact fee funds. Impact fee funds are used to as a way to offset the impact of new development. The idea being that developers will or new ones would bear the cost of needed upsides and some things in the system to provide the same level of service that citizens currently enjoy today. So everybody clear on that. They're very structured. There are very lot of laws tied to them, how you can spend them, when you can spend them, and some things like that. So there's one we have a water impact fee. And, again, most of this money that comes in is just gonna go right back out towards our well project. We believe we have 2,000,000 in impact fees and

I'm gonna go back to the water to remember how much in the water, but but that mine will be used

for the new well. Can't remember what the combined total was. Parking pad fees, the big projects that we're looking at in parks is the Nibley City Central Park. We've got we broke Nibley Meadows Park kind of in a two phases, kind of a design for the entire park and then a phase one. And maybe we'll go into those out backwards, but so we're looking at City Center Park and Nible Meadows Park is kinda where we're putting our efforts and putting our money towards in the near future. Sewer impact fees. Basically, this is just making the payment on our loan that we have with the state, which is a 0% interest loans. And we have will be paid off in 2034. So less than ten years till that's paid off, we believe. But, again, it's zero interest, so we haven't seen any Okay. Push to to pay that off. So we're just kinda collecting those impact fees and using it to pay down our loan. The sunflower impact fee was an interesting one. It's it was specific to the Discovery Ponds, actually, that we already mentioned, and a pond off that currently does not exist off of 26 North of Stonebridge subdivision. Stonebridge is phase one, two, and three, and Heritage Crossing were designed to go or slated to go to this pond. And so there was a structure system set up. I mean, I'm talking twenty years ago, kind of set up a little long time ago. Maybe not twenty.

But

homes that were constructed in that designated area paid a fee that what got stuck into this account or into this fund. So we've treated it like an impact fee even though it's not really an impact fee, you know, a true impact fee, but we've sort of treated it that way. And we have are basically just kinda sitting on that money right now to see if and when we need to pull the trigger and build that pawn. With the construction of Heritage Crossing subdivision, that's probably sooner than later. So Tom's got some preliminary engineering green lights to get some studies going, something there. Just try to get that in design. I doubt we're gonna be able to build it for $2.50 unless we do a lot of work ourselves. So we'll just have to figure out how to pay for that. Please. Yes. On Heritage Crossing,

there is a newly owned parcel just to the West, Heritage Crossing. That is owned park school. So impact fees park impact fees that we collect for Heritage Crossing, if and when will those need to be used, and do they will they be used on that park? They need to start at 50 Park?

Sorry.

I I think I was just wondering that she's talking about.

The the old little piece of property just left of

is it all Heritage Cropping? Let's go ahead and see what we saw. Heritage Parkway, maybe? 2612

Hundred West?

Yeah. So there's a five acre there's a five acre piece of property

west and north of Latest Route. Northeast north and east. Stonebridge.

Yeah. That is that has been planned and pegged for that stormwater. So that's not a park that's been planned to be the storm regional stormwater bomb.

That's just a zoning designation.

Yep. Well, this this is what you're talking. Correct? Yeah. So this has always been slated to be for more. On in this plan to zoom.

Park

stormwater, and then you pondering because we've done that in the past.

I would like to see, if I may, like, each one of those labels on quick. Just quick explanation. When this thing was on designed in early phases, it's trying to be figured out. This area here all drained to the Discovery Ponds Mhmm. Where the Frisbee Golf is and Stonebridge, and all of this area was designed to go to this pond. So what happens here, because some of this has already been built and taken to the other ponds, I would like to see this reduced as much as possible and maybe reserve some sort of commercial space there that we can put in

commercial property

And sell it? And sell it and have some smaller belong me back here and sell it from half for a commercial would be my thoughts I've had and what I would potentially bring to the council at some point.

And I think that's predicated by the thought that there's some commercial development going on in that area. We could in theory. Yeah. This is all theoretical. Yeah. I mean I guess, well, I guess, what would you like to need is five acre piece of carpet. I think the consensus system says water is going to other places. We don't need fire at Pompey. So what's a higher and better use? As long as we take care of stormwater still, what's a higher and better use for that piece of property than off in theory. Could be a park. Could be a park. Could be could be next to other commercial stuff. Sure. Someday. Yeah. Maybe. Yeah. The problem with predicting the future is nobody knows what's gonna happen. Yeah. If if somebody goes to it.

Okay. But that is the place where you have to find There that's this one.

K.

Specifically. Right?

Taken taken. We'll do that. K. Yeah. Good question.

Stream impact fee, we don't have any streaming products right now, so we're just taking that money, putting it in bank account. Okay. Now we get to some of the fund funds. Capital projects. So this is a list of all the revenue that's going into the capital projects. And you'll notice along the left here, we've tried to start kinda pay things and market things that are associated with grants. So most of the income into the capital projects is from a grant with the exception of this line right here, this 140,000, which is just what we transfer in from the general fund every year. So in the past, we've used this line to balance, which I'll talk more about later, if anybody cares, but we balance out the capital projects and balance the general funds. We transfer from general fund into capital project. Now like I said, this is sort of based on not a lot of development. You can see that back in 2425, we actually moved over a million dollars even though we had a plan back in. That year, I think we had $508.04. Shouldn't look. I can't remember. But that's quite a bit more than we anticipated moving more because of growth and because of development. So and this number right here also is gonna become important when we start talking about tax increase. So where this budget currently does move some money from the general fund into the capital projects. Now before we finalize this, say, some of these numbers may shuffle a little bit. Grants, we might try to get some of that in our pocket. So you'll see money that we actually receive will show up in this column, which will reduce the amount we expect to receive next year in some of these. So you might see this column shift a little bit as we get closer to the final budget. This is a current list of the capital projects that we have been working on over the past few years. I should have this pulled up on my screen. It's just I had my glasses so I could read them. But there's a few new ones that we need to talk about, not big ones, but our IT is recommending we replace our some software on our firewall that's decade or more older. And so there's some money there to reduce some IT's firewall. We've had some discussion about kinda doing a spruce up of city hall. If you notice, there's some paint missing, some issues with the floor. So we we talked about maybe little bit of mine tours and sprucing this building up. We've also got a grant application in for a rec trailer. That's the other thing. So one of these projects that are tied to grants are dependent on receiving the grant, and we may not even get so in some cases, we don't know if we're gonna get the grant yet, but we plan for it as if we're gonna get it and spend accordingly. And if we don't get the grant, we don't spend the money on the other side, if that makes sense. So I know we can't see all those, but this is where we're gonna wanna spend some time as we move forward and really nail down and discuss these projects and how this money will fit. Please?

Was the hardship conversion project

speaking for the grant through. Is that grant listed on here as well?

Yeah. Appreciate it upon her. Follow the double check.

Oh, water, white parts here. Yes. Yeah.

Yeah. Okay. Yeah.

Yeah. Typically, when a council puts a project on here, it doesn't disappear until it's deleted, typically. It's very very rarely delivered. It's bad bad. And and or the council says, no. Thanks. We're not doing this. Staff doesn't really if that helps you, I guess. So we'll work the back of this. Again, most of this stuff is stuff we've been working on, so it shouldn't be any surprise. Maybe this is these last few of the fall, but I don't know. So happy to have lots of discussion about cabinet projects. And here comes the big one. General fund is one of the many end groups or one of the accounts that we have to manage. It seems like it gets a lot of attention because it pays for so many different things. These are all of the things that the general fund covers. Lots of different stuff across the board. This is a breakdown of the department in your general fund just to give you an ideas where we will need to decide what relation wise from one to the other and and where the general fund gets spent. Here deals the actual numbers behind the general fund. The different departments are listed here on the left, and this is the amount. Wait. Wait. They're not working anymore.

Okay. Gotcha.

This one does work, Ken.

Mhmm. I'm at the Kroger. This one's almost

blinds here.

What's going up here? Really a whole lot. This is the expense side of things. So

We're gonna stay here. Yeah.

Had a nice big red circle put over that one. 69% budget change. So we kinda hinted already. We've had some discussions about the fire district, what's happening with the fire district, what may or may not happen with the fire district, and we don't wanna hash all those out right now. But they're right in the middle of discussing that, and depending on where that lands, this

well, this cost probably isn't gonna change much.

We can we've got two bids in hand with a third potential that we don't think we'll be able to beat the two we already have. So this number is a big number, a big increase that we need to figure out how to pay for.

And that really has little to do with the fire district. It's more to do with the fact that I will admit we've been getting, compared to other cities, way undercharged by. And in fact,

EMS probably have to try to spot the, you know,

for that service as well. And folks have figured that out. Yes. Yeah. And and so what say, under charge, I mean, that's relative to what other cities have paid on both a property tax basis. Yeah. Normalizing how much some city one city pays

by normalizing by

taxable property taxable value in their city versus our city. We may get a very, very good deal. Now we're talking about hiring about three x increase in the meter. Doesn't mean any of us are happy. But the other bids are bearing out, but that's probably what it's gonna cost

to have buyer education in your booth. That's.

There does the it's a three x to go with Hirer, and we're looking at other alternatives. We're getting other bids. One from camp, one from another municipality. But the higher number at three x is not an unreasonable number compared to these other other bids we're getting. Is that fair to say? Yeah.

So that's, like, far the biggest increase in the general fund. But

no. No.

No buts. That is the biggest increase in the general fund. So, again, just state, we have built this budget to be as worst case scenario as possible. So nothing better happens. We should be able to cover our expenses and with the tax increase even more cover our expenses. But some of if some of the things happen with the fire district about reimbursing. Our citizens are still gonna pay this money, but they may pay to the fire district, and the fire district will turn around and give it to us, which means there will be no tax increase for us. So On that item. On that item.

Does that make any sense? We need to come up with $686,000 for FHIR and EMS. I think that's what's another Well,

is that There's more than just fire and EMS in that. They just sheriff too? Yes. That includes the sheriff. That includes salary for our part time emergency manager. So we're going costs from fire are going from about $1.10 up to between 360 and 400,000.

Right. So that money for fire, since that cost is increasing to what we think is actually a reasonable rate, that either needs to come out of Midland City general fund, which represents a tax increase in this budget, or there's the expired district that's talking about shifting at shifting and probably the amount that we shifted from the county general fund is money that is collected by the county into their general fund to pay for a fire that were you know, different cities have different opinions on what benefit we actually get from the county on that. We're taking that money out of the general fund in the county and issuing it to cities in a voucher so that they can spend that money on fire protection. And that means we don't have to cover that all of the increased cost for fire protection in our budget, but some of it will be covered by money currently collected by the county and going into the county general fund. So to our citizens, the change in expense for fire protection doesn't change. Because right now, they're paying money to the county. Instead, they'll be paying it to a special to a fire district. Right? But the as it shifts to the fire district, we don't have to make up all of that increased expense in our general fire. So this number assumes nothing from the county on a voucher?

Correct.

Alright.

Pretty sure we'll get something. Which should

drastically reduce, if not eliminate, the need for tax increase.

So we're still advertising the fifth Yep. Budget because none of the none of that voucher from the fire district and none of that committee from the county is quick,

you know, quick

taking money on county property taxes has been finalized, which meetings have seemed to go every week. We got board meetings next week to figure out what that's actually gonna be Tuesday. City council in third is gonna vote on this. Sorry. County council.

So so it's changed rapidly evolving. Stay tuned, please.

So when we're done with the topic sorry. I should know this, but what's the community development band? Line?

Yeah. Why is your department called that, Chad?

Yeah. It's community development and recreation.

I understand. I have a question. Please. So when you look at these I mean, just correct me. Is that just through, like, this month? So, like, actual 2520

session?

Yeah. That is the date. Okay. To date in our financial statements, that's the number. That's the date or May 1, I believe. Either ending or May 1. I'm not sure which one. Today, that's what we have. Yes. Great question.

So we have to finish a year with more expenses there. Yeah. Because what Chris has, like, actuals very soon, we budgeted 58 of growth.

We didn't even spend all the budget. Right. Great point.

So

okay. Thank you. You have a great point. And we should be at some point, maybe it doesn't have to be tonight when that's through April or through May so we know how to extrapolate it through the year. Yeah. That's good. Yeah. And Amy

Amy all over that and, like, the minute she can put those in, then she's. So

the we keep those up to date as absolute as possible. I'm pretty sure it doesn't include June.

It's

getting late. K. So as stated before, the general fund is many, many accounts or funds that we manage an account or take care of. Within a general fund, there are multiple ways we receive money. You can see them here. I mean, we'll talk about administrative charges later. Taxes include multiple kinds of taxes. We're gonna come back to that. Charges for service of things for, like, garbage, nine one one. There's things mostly that show up on utility bills. They get basically passed on in some cases, so we'll live on fee. And so seeing a mail was again, but the difference tax well, here's it again. All the different kind of just the numbers behind the pie chart on the different revenues that come into the general fund. K. So this is how it acts as we just go back here and we take this one line, the taxes.

Right? The 3.5,

we're gonna break that in what kind of taxes. Most of the taxes we will see are from sales tax and property tax. Property taxes, what you see on your state once a year, and then you pay mostly with your mortgage. Sales tax are those money you spend Mhmm. In state in Utah, a collective state collects the tax and then distributes it based on a formula on populations. That's where we get most of our sales tax. Some of our sales tax, we give a little more if it's the sale happens within Nibley City, which is called point of sale tax. And I can't remember we never saw the actual breakdown, but given the amount of transactions we have going on in Nibley City, most of our sales tax money comes just based off the population

projection.

So those makeup are two main sources of income when it comes to the one line of the 50 different revenues that come in with Nipley Saving. K. So here are different kinds of taxes besides property. Right? Property sorry. This is just no. We're just back at that point chart. There's a property tax. There's a sales tax. There's the other taxes. Franchise taxes are typically paid by utilities such as Comcast.

Keith. Telecom

thing. Go ahead now, but it's essentially utilities permission to go in our heads. It's essentially what it is. They they pay essentially

sales tax on utilities. Sales tax on

change it to services, but I'm not sure that's right either. So yeah. So we also get vehicle taxes. You register your vehicles and you pay the county for those and the county I'm sure that I think it goes back to the state and back to us. And vehicle taxes.

Only new again.

It's been nice. So feel free to correct me. It's been out on the but, again, we feel the transit tax. So there's very little money to this year. We don't know exactly which we're gonna get there. The mass transit taxes is every single year. I have this question, and I'm confused with Dave. Why is this Dave's our accountant. Dave, why is this number here? And it is it's essentially a tax that goes to CBTD that's kinda sort of from us. So we never even see the money, but we have to show up in our accounting. I don't I'm I'm sorry. I don't understand all those things, but it's a it's a it's basically money and money out. So there's a corresponding expense for a $150,000 on the on the other side.

We never really see that one, but it comes with the zone

to CVT. So, again, like, what is that? 10 different kinds of the taxes that come into the general fund.

Just the So Yeah. Go ahead.

Where you're seeing a 30% increase in real property.

Is that just through discussions you had with the county? No. That's with the tax increase that I keep talking about. Oh, with the with the increase. That's with the increase. Right. So Mhmm. The board needs to This is a tentative budget. Bone disclosure, this is a tentative budget that anticipates

a 31%

increase in real property taxes. Right. And we'll we'll split that up because it's actually only 21%. But we get the growth. I'm estimating the growth to be between 40 to $50,000. So the actual increases when we and we're again, we're. So hold that thought for a second. We'll We'll come back to the property tax. That's what we're headed. I'm trying to show you that there's all these different taxes and all these different ways to get money into the general fund to pay for all these tons of things. And we're gonna talk about this huge percentage of tax increase and and what that really means. So these are some things that have gone up in our budget that we have to pay for. I'm just there. I mean, we're a target fire. Our law enforcement contract is is gone up. I have to pull it exactly. I know I'm dispatched. I think I have this listed on the next agenda. I mean, to kinda talk about the increase in each. But, anyway, all these things have gone. IT service contracts took maybe at this year. Our accountant raised his cost, which he hasn't raised his cost and or I but he finally had to raise those. Our insurance went up a little bit. Banking fees are go up not only with just increased fees, but also the number of transactions we make as we get more and more citizens and more permits and things that happen. All those fees go up. We have inflationary pressures. And one of the other kind of bigger ones that increases is employee salaries, and we're gonna to go over this in detail as well with the worth of work study we put into place two or three years ago. All those things have to be covered and paid for. I feel like those are kind of the ones that barring any discussion about fire that wasn't even on the table, and we needed this money to cover these things. I feel like these are the things we don't have a lot of choice. We gotta figure out how to pay for. Now these last few were kinda worth the extras, if you will, that we survive if you guys were to say no thanks on a tax increase. These are this is what would be cut. We would definitely not hire another full time employee. We would not march purchase $30,000 for park maintenance. We would not provide a 3% cost of living adjustment to our employees, and we would not put any money into our capital projects for future savings. So those are the only four areas I felt like like I mean, we run tight. We run lean. I just don't feel like there's a lot of other places we could cut. And, I mean, the the 3% there, the only reason that's on there is because it's such a big number. And that that tear my heart out if we don't end up funding that, but it's literally I don't think one thing we could cut. And so, again, those are the big thing. We'll hit those again on the next gen item, but those are the things because of the fire increase and all these other increases, these are things we're gonna lose out on per this plan tentative budget. Now we could keep talking. We could try to figure out ways to cut that up and move things around if we want it. But the way it's built now, those are the things that we would lose. Wait.

The way the budget's built now, it doesn't include the Papers. Yeah.

If you do not increase taxes or the fire dumpster stuff doesn't come through and you guys just say no to the tax increase, that's what we'll lose out.

The budget funds these items. Correct.

Yes. K. So here we get into true taxation. With the current tax rate and the current tax revenue of 1,100,000, I expect that when we get our growth number that our revenue should be about $1,150,000 in the one line of the 50 different lines we have in budget that we will need to increase that number by $250,000, which would bring our total revenue 1,400,000 and my estimated tax rate up to point o o one six eight. And those that have been around for twenty five years might recognize that number. Interesting. Yep. Very interesting. So when you calculate that $250,000 into that amount of revenue increase, the property tax increase is 21%. The revenue from our property tax line in the budget is 21%, which amounts to $81 a year or six dollars and eighty cents for a primary residence with a market value of $495,000.

Is that our median

home price? Yes. It is. Now there's there's stars and cents here. Right? After I went to talk to Diana today, I changed that number to $4.95 and change to be exact exact because I'm not taking any chances. So you'll see on the property tax statement, property tax impact statement that is the next coming down on the agenda. You know, these these cents will be different. It's very, very close, but it's a couple cents off. So so, again, a primary residence, if it's your primary home, you're gonna pay $6.80 more a month to gather this extra $250. If it's not your primary residence, but it's still a residence, you're $12.37, and the average business in the city right now is worth $1,500,000. This increase will impact them $37.63 a month month. I don't know why I did that backwards. $451 a year. So that is the impact on an average home or business in Nibley City if we accept this tentative budget with the property tax increase. Everybody clear on that? This is just the the first slide I showed you guys on all the different revenues that come into the city. This next slide kinda gives you a comparison. We all of this dark green stuff is not general fund. This quarter was the general fund. This is the actual impact to our citywide budget, 1%. So, yes, it's 21% of our property tax, but it is 1% less it is less than 1% of our entire budget revenue. Clear? Okay. So we talked about so those are all the funds, and now kinda kinda get into some bigger issues that impact more than one fund. So salaries is obviously a big one. Our most important resource within the city is our awesome team. They do an amazing job. I'm super proud of all that they do. And a few year this is just a spreadsheet to show you that none of this is willy nilly. We calculate to the penny. We have every employee. We have what the color might be. We have what their base or performance might be based on the worth of work that we talked about. All of that translates into a benefits spreadsheet where we go through each employee and talk about what insurance plan they picked, how much it's gonna cost us, and all those things out. So this isn't I'm proud of this because this is one of the major areas where we really tightened the bell on not overestimating. And we wanna be conservative, but we do not want this this number used to be just be so overinflated that it was ridiculous. So we really honed in on this. And to the point, honestly, I'm a little uncomfortable as I could appreciate more cushion. We've only given a 2% cushion on this stuff for the year. So, again, this is to show you that we're not really dealing about this. This is the work of work plan. I know this might be new to some of you. I don't wanna go into great detail of it. I'm happy to do that if anybody has questions or wants to talk about it. But, essentially, what we did a few years ago is we took all of the different jobs and positions in the city. We compared them to other similar sized towns across the state of Utah and Southern Idaho to get a baseline for what the minimum of those jobs for a job salary range would be. So, basically, what's the minimum if you were to hire somebody to do this job? What would be the minimum you would pay that person? Then we calculated how big of a band we wanted. We recommend 55%, so we kind of built this band for each job in Digley City. And based on four criteria, we ranked those jobs and gave them a job value, which put you kinda sorry. Getting twisting myself up here. We have the minimum, we got the maximum, then we got the midpoint. The idea was to try to get employees to the midpoint of their range in around the five year period because at that point, you'd be paying them as well or better than the surrounding cities and around you so that you kinda held on to those employees. They felt valued. They had a good income. It was higher than likely they could go find anywhere else. So the idea was to try to increase and improve to get our employees at least up to that midpoint. And this is where we started. You could see that a lot of some of them were, some of them were low, below the midpoint even though they've been here longer than five years. And so with the worth of work and the proposed increases, you can see and I apologize for a little anomaly here. I didn't have time to fix it, but that's because one of our employees just doesn't work the full twenty, eighty hours. So the dots moved most of the dots now are moved up and close to and or slightly above that midpoint, which means that in the future, our pay for performance raises should taper off and start to come down. This year, it's about average of 2.6% when I take up all the salaries and put that into an average for everybody. So this tentative budget includes paid for performance adjustments, which basically means the supervisor gets to sit down and have a discussion with his employee or her employee and say, based on your performance, we're gonna recommend a zero to 5% in most cases just to try to if you're under the midpoint. If you're over the midpoint, you're looking at the one or 2%. So I'm kinda starting to run. So any questions there on what's proposed with salaries? This is the overall impact. That's an 89% increase based on all the criteria I just talked about. And the 9% includes hiring an employee. That's not all raises

Oracle. Go ahead. Your final cost is separate from 3%. Correct. So the Wow where the work is based on performance,

the cost of living adjustment or cola is across the board to try to keep up with inflation. So those bands, if I were to go back to this chart, those move up as the cola increases so that they're not getting behind and they're we're getting to the midpoint and at least staying there creeping up. What you're saying here did you say regardless of if you're

you're still eligible for

oh, wow. Yeah. It was for two. They taper off before below the Yep. See, like, two to 5% to try to get moved up. Once you hit the midpoint, it is slowing down. And we had a long discussion with staff around, and this good idea, bad idea. We found different ways to slice it up, and we we finally wrapped back around, decided to stick to or at least try to stick to for a while what was recommended to us by the consultant that helped us put this together, Mike Swall, who is he? And so this is kinda what we're trying to stick to. At least the next few years to try to see if it works and to see if it really keeps people happy, if it keeps people here, and not out looking for other jobs. I know that's new to a lot of you guys, and, again, I'm happy to show the spreadsheet over all of that. Happy to do that if you have questions.

With default?

Yeah. I think it was. Now prior, we used to be 2%. It's the kind of standard forever, forever, and ever, and then holy smokes. COVID and some other things happened. I think we bought seven one year and five one year, three last year. Cheryl, correct me if I'm wrong, went to a group HR discussion just this week. 3% of the billings is is is the average in cash value. Exactly. Same. Okay. So the norm in cash value, or was it that was just cash value? We had a spreadsheet with the rest of the state, and we looked at that one. We could we could double check that, but I think it's the right CPI. CPI, I'm.

Yeah.

I think that's three. He was right at three when I looked at it three months ago, two months ago. Could we move on? Questions there?

Okay. One of the other big

things we've tried to really bring in and make sure we're taking advantage of and not overspending on is our travel training education. It's just so much money to send people to go get this education. Now we value and appreciate the heck out of the education that our people do get. We we we know it's important. We wanna give them those opportunities to go learn and bring those things back to the city. You guys have been great to to fund that stuff. But this is just to show you what has changed, not a lot of change. You'll actually see the the decrease laser laser on the the was a national conference that Steve went to last year. If you remember, he talked to you guys about that. So, anyway, there's we just wanna let you know we're watching that carefully and making sure we're not abusing that. Back to the growth, I told you guys I'd show you some charts and explain some of the assumptions that we made. This is the building permits that have been issued over the last ten years or so. The top three are single family homes, townhouses, and condos. So with maroon, meat, and cream. Now here's a potentially and I'm I'm embarrassed to admit that I just realized this a few days ago and have Austin and Levi kinda toying with this and gonna really nail this down and figure it out. But in the past, I've always assumed that with our billing permits, those three carried the day and that they were they are by far the biggest source of revenue, but there's always other permits to bring in money. And it's certainly not gonna make or break the budget, but I wanna take advantage of that and make sure that we're not ignoring it. Because this line is one that's always off every year so bad, and I've just never been able to nail down and figure out what or why. But I think that's gonna be part of the issue is just these other permits and them bringing in money. So you'll notice this I've added this line here. It's just $27,000. Honestly, it was to balance the budget, but it was to show income to the general fund

from from Bill,

basically. But what I've done is based on this chart, based on talking to Austin and seeing what's out there available and what we think might happen in the next few years or excuse me, next year, we're thinking about a 125 units. And of those 125, 66 are townhouses. The rest are single family homes. Now that's down a little bit. Last year, that number was higher, but based on, in fact, originalized almost, you know, as far into it as they are. And, you know, it's not being quite so far ahead and kind of dropped in a little bit. What that does is calculates all the impact fees, all the connection fees for water, sewer, and distributes them throughout the rest of the budget. So to be honest, we could probably jack that number to 200. We may or may not get 200 units built and pay for our fire increase. But now we are building a budget that is dependent on building and growth. And we have said we don't wanna do that. And so any money extra that comes in mostly to impact fees just stays in impact fees. Any money that goes to the general fund is what we end up rolling over and transferring to capital projects. So as we think about capital projects, we should realize that a lot of that money came from growth. And then if we need to spend some of that money to solve growth problems, that should be okay with us, I think, or at least in my opinion. Any thoughts on that adjusting that number or tweaking that number?

The billing permit? Yeah. I I say stay conservative. Thanks.

Oh, yeah. The type of shit. Add

admin fees. Admin fees are fees that are paid by the water department, the sewer department, and the stormwater department back to the general fund to pay for things that are spread out across multiple departments. Right? So, like, you know, my salaries, Tom's salary, even Wendy, Cheryl, everybody touches water, sewer, stormwater in some way. So we go through this complicated little it's not complicated. We kinda take an estimate on what we think, how much time, or in some cases, not people, but line items in the budget. How much of that line item in the budget is touches water, sewer, stormwater, and we kinda spread out those costs amongst those three and transfer money out of those funds into the general fund. And this year, it increased a bit more so than last year's because of the GIS software. And that's paid for or not. It's the GIS, I think. No. I'm sorry. It's the iWORKS software work order stuff, which is mostly sewer water. Not mostly. It's it just touches those. And because of that increase, I I bumped that line up a little bit. So, anyway, this is a little bit bigger bump than we usually see. And these aren't great. And as we get bigger and bigger and Lars hiring people and things and standing on their own, you might see these fees come down. But for now, they're a pretty important role in helping us cover expenses in our geo fund. But, again, this is to show us, you know, we're not just guessing. This stuff, we're really trying to nail this stuff in. Okay. Matt, how how did you how long have I been talking?

Yes. Well, probably not Almost a minute now. A little pretty much about fifteen minutes. That's nine. Good. I'm sorry. I have no, like, five minutes.

Feels a good stopping point for us. I have more slides if you wanna get into understanding what property taxes, how it moves, have growth, and how growth plays into it, just kinda basic stuff, also budget stuff. I can hit that stuff later individually if you'd like or whatnot, but I just wanted to tell you that information is out there if you had questions. So any questions? You've only got two months to finalize this and ask questions and tweak it. So I or do you get your cost of living adjustment? I'm looking at margin of 10%.

Are you looking at Is that gas is that gas prices?

Tom thinks it should be a 10% hold. No. I was just wondering where that that 3% came

from. I just looked at the consumer price index, Deer Rock Labor Statistics, twelve month kind of average from March March to March. Mhmm. I'm seeing around 3.3. 3.3,

but 1010%

just this month or last month. Well, hope we don't have that every month. Yeah.

Any questions?

Pretty soon, this will return to a federal discussion. K. Again, I just wanna point out Yeah. This tentatively

proposed budget includes a property tax increase. By the way, we talked about those that have been here a long time about recognized.

Isn't that ironic?

Is it back still coming at? We're missing something? Well,

I don't know I don't know that you're missing anything. I think that, you know, we've talked about a 60.7 per mil kind of property tax rate that's point zero zero one six seven. Turns out I've learned to speak in per mil since then on the fire district, which is just one part per thousand one per thousand. Like, percent is one per 100. Well, per mill is one per thousand. It's simple in that concept. So when we say a 16.7 per mill property tax rate, that means of the taxable value of property in Nibley City, we would assess a point zero zero one six seven property tax rate to that to generate the property tax.

Right? So,

historically, empirically, I would say, 16.7 mills has been, you know, kinda like what we have thought for twenty years that kinda need to run the city based on our economic lack of diversity, etcetera, etcetera. Mostly, you know I mean, there's sales tax, property tax. We've gotten away from that 16.7 mills in recent years because we've had marginal smaller increases that have brought that down to about only about 14 mills from 16.7 to about 14. And so when we start talking about all the stuff that maybe, tentatively, would require getting trued up plus increase in cost for fire protection.

You know, we're back up

pretty darn close to the 16.7 mills at 16.8. Now I think Justin might talk about how this tentative is a worst case kind of analysis, but that's because the you know, we need to disclose worst case kind of possibilities if there's any chance that we're gonna move forward with the property tax increase.

But, historically, ten years ago, Nibley City held that number for Yeah. Decades. Yeah.

I mean, we let it slip couple years if it was a 1% kind of

Yeah.

Increase in total dollars collected minus growth. We'd let the rate slip a little bit to not go through the proof of taxation. We could do that a few years. Kinda like we've done the last few years here. I haven't done a proof of taxation. Right. For the last three years. Yeah. So we've kinda used to do it over the last year.

Justin, question? Please. Page 11, it it lists our city's mission statement.

PDF. It is not the mission. Yeah. I think he may ask me about that, and I'm probably here or bad.

Correct?

We're we can update that. Yeah.

Thank you,

So

what we saw if we saw that?

Yeah.

One of the things I think about when we think about capital projects, so it's dawning on me that our growth has traffic impacts, has pedestrian safety impacts, and it has bicycle safety impacts, active transportation, and vehicle safety impacts. I mean, I hear a lot from residents about how fast cars go in front of their house and can we do something to stop that, so on and so forth. So,

I mean, I'm I'm not

I'm not making any proposal at this point to this extent. But if we find ways to spend capital project money on the mitigating growth, I mean, that's a great place to spend capital project money on that vehicle. Vehicle safety and active transportation safety. We have a $100,000

grant for advanced security and safety improvements. Right? No. We have, like, $202,179,000

dollars. For demonstration.

For demonstration. Yeah.

And I think that means we have to use that demonstrate, which I think is a great way to get to yes.

Yeah. We it's pretty well defined what we're gonna use that for in the in the the grant application and what what it was awarded for, which locations, and and what the types of treatments that we're gonna be looking at there. It's mostly mostly intersection safety and crossing improvements at at specific intersections that we identified.

Right. But that could be pretty exciting to us about how we can improve that.

Exactly. And and

not only how we can improve it, but what will be acceptable to try to help all users see the impact of these demonstration projects and then go all the way to finish the finish line. And, Tom, what did our pedestrian processing at 3200 South between Andrew Park and Ridge Sowing cost? $3,588,000. So there's most of our budget from that.

Right.

Improving safe with that. Pedestrian safe.

Mhmm.

K. So, again, this is a resolution that we would recommend waiving the first or the second reading reading

again. It's a tentative budget.

Need to make a motion with you. Resolution twenty six ten. The tentative budget. Yeah. Wait.

I have a motion for Nathan.

This would adopt the tentative budget that should be done. Yeah. We don't wanna adopt it yet.

It's a tentative budget.

We have to help the public carry on the next meeting.

Okay.

The next two, you do wanna wait. So Next two, we wanna wait. Okay.

I'd like to.

Didn't get a second. So So I assume you tell me all your. The motion for Nathan and a second. Okay.

Aaron, thank you.

Comments, discussions? Any opposition voting? Seeing none, those in favor, please say aye. No. Are there any opposed?

K. Thank you.

K. So I think these others go a little faster. Right? Yes. Hopefully, it gets a little goofy here.

But item number 14, just wanna point out that an executive officer of Nibley City intends to state in a public meeting that the tentative budget includes a proposed tax increase.

So you have not only intended to say that?

I am telling you that I intend to say that in the next agenda item. Okay? So I intended to tell you. Now I'm gonna tell you that I'm gonna make a statement that the Nibley City tentative 2627 budget includes a proposed property tax increase.

And you are the budget officer for Nibley City? Yes, sir.

What else do we need? Your name?

Name, rank, and serial number.

K. So with that, we'll move I guess, I'll ask if it's sixteenth. What if we Alright. Item 16, if you can pull up the text, EPIK statement. So this is a new

16. Actually, 16. 16.

I don't see a 16. Was it this one? 15? Yeah. Somehow.

Okay. Yeah. Yeah.

K. So this is not information that is new to you. This is a property tax impact schedule that is required new requirement by state law. This needs to be a separate agenda item on every budget discussion we have from here on out discussing the property tax increase. So we've been over the details that were based on my estimates of where our certified tax rate's gonna end up. We need to include an additional $250,000 into the general fund from property tax, which would increase revenue from property tax by 21%, which would impact a resident a primary residential home value of $495,518 to $81.76 a year. A nonprimary residence value the same would be a $148.65 per year, and a business average or sorry. A business valued at $1,100,000,505,481. The impact would be $451.64 per year. So that is the impact that we're talking about to get that extra $250,000 into the fund general fund from property tax. So these individual departments will be affected by those four things that we talked about. The biggest being the biggest book. The four, I'll go through each one to make sure we check our boxes. But in the city council, basically, adding a thousand dollars to cover the 3% colo. We established a policy to the council. Salary has received the same colo as the staff and employees do. So that's rounded. Certainly not a thousand dollars, but just to keep round numbers, you add a thousand dollars there. In the administration department, it's the same. It's just the cost of living adjustment that is proposed in the works. It's an addition $12,000 for the cost of living. Non departmental is where we move money from the general fund into capital projects. So we're anticipating tentatively planning to move January over into the capital projects. In the streets department, We are covering the cost of the 3% COLA in addition to half the expense of a new full time employee. The other half to be covered by the stormwater fund. Oh, goodness. Sorry about that. In the planning department is just the cola. In the parks department, it is the cola and additional $30,000 for some equipment to go with the Ventrac piece of equipment that we bought last year. It's basically an area of boom mower. Boom mower is would allow us to maybe do a better job on mowing along trails where there's steeper slopes like along the Foxborough Trail, places like that. And in recreation departments, it's additional $8,000 for just the cost of living. And in the this is an interesting one because the tax the tax increase see, make sure I get this right. Because of the way the 3% COLA affects salaries, The admin fees change and balance out there. They're actually less. Is this I'm not gonna explain this very well. Because of, yeah, water sewer and So not improving the tax increase lowers the amount of revenue the general fund receives from these departments because their salaries were not being increased as well. I figured if we weren't gonna increase general fund salaries, we didn't wanna increase water or sewer and those other funds. Anyway so so, anyway, it is that is the impact of the additional $250,000 into the general fund. Here are some other increases just for FYI and how much they are in the general fund. You can see those listed there. I don't need to read them all, but just these are impacts to the general fund that need to be covered but will be covered regardless of the

What I'm interested in seeing all of those. So what item is this in Teams 18? It's 15. Actually, 15.1 is what it's titled.

While he's looking that up, I'll make sure that everybody is aware that Thursday, 05/28/2026, there will be a public hearing about this tentative budget. And we encourage

all residents to participate. Which is our next regularly scheduled day council? Correct. That is it.

Yeah. I mean, overwhelmingly, it's 262,000 for a fire protection contract.

K.

K. That is your my presentation.

So that takes care of 16. Yep. Then we have another resolution to discuss and consider, resolution twenty six eleven.

And this resolution basically says you are witnessing that I just said all the things that I said. Well, honestly, I hope that because most of this came from League of Cities and Towns, and I'm hoping that they made it so dramatic for a reason to, like, get the attention of them to say this is silly.

Not most of these changes. Most of this training on how to achieve the changes. Mhmm. Right? I mean, the League of Cities and Towns didn't enact additional legislation. They'll legislate. Correct.

Correct. The the Yeah. But they're the ones that told us exactly what to put on the agendas and in the resolution so that we meet all the i's and the t's to get crossed. So I think Cheryl had something.

Just letting the accounts below, you'll see almost duplicate resolutions. Every being we have where the budget is discussed. So if you start thinking doing so, I'm gonna forget, we we kind of are. I just wanted to know. I had training with branch clerks and headquarters, and the training are very similar. So not much difference.

Okay. So moved to your consideration of resolution twenty six eleven.

The motion to press 2611. Wait a second, Lee.

The motion from Nathan. So and a second from Nick to adopt resolution twenty six eleven doing as stated and waving second reading. Discussion on that? Is there an objection to voting? Saying none, may you please call the wall? Oh, thank you.

Can't remember that person. What did you vote? In favor.

In favor. In favor.

In favor. In favor. In favor. In favor. In

favor. Thank you.

Five in favor. None opposed. Passes unanimously. View, names, and mislead. Thank you very much, counsel. Let's move on to twenty six twelve. Resolution twenty six twelve.

And I don't know if I'm getting fried or not, but I, for the life of me, don't understand the two diff the difference between these two. I know I knew it at one point, but it's not coming to me on why what this resolution that don't it sounds almost work for work. But Well. Well Kinda gives more direction on that and where to post things. Yeah. I think that's it. Just read it out, man.

If you can set the date and time and place of the truce of taxation hearing, and also

acknowledges that we sent and that we intended to raise taxes to the town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town town

So we have achieved number three.

But, yeah, what is taken in those days?

When we are keeping end of auto. All of these groups, the state and commission has to be able to find us within five minutes. At the end, this is our.

K.

K. Now if you're you're interested in emotion, I mean, specific. What do you view a motion to

resolution twenty six twelve with that the word resolved corrected in its spelling.

I have a need a motion from Nathan to approve twenty six twelve, a second from Nick to adopt resolution 20 c's 12 with a clerical correction. Any discussion? Any opposition to voting? Seeing none, chair, will you please call the roll?

Council member. Council