Hyde Park City Council Meeting 10.22.2025

Good. Excellent. I guess Did you say all set? Yeah. Alright. Just wanna welcome everybody to our Hyde Park City Council meeting for October 22. We appreciate everyone coming to

meet with the council.

The first item of business is is council member Tiffany Atkinson will lead us in a prayer, and then we'll move on from there.

K. Let's start with the prayer. Our dear heavenly father, we're grateful that we are able to meet this night as citizens of High Park City. We're grateful for our community for the good people that live here and for the attitude of service that prevails in our community. We're grateful for the ability to govern ourselves and to work together to create a community that is enjoyable for all. We pray that this night that as we discuss the meeting and the agenda items that we will have ears to listen and minds that are open to discussion on how to resolve issues and to create decisions that are in the best interest of our community that we might be mindful and forward thinking in our decisions. We're grateful for the freedom we have and for the blessings we enjoy in this beautiful community. And we pray for these things in the name of thy son, Jesus Christ. Amen. Amen. Please stand and join me in the pledge of allegiance.

Thank you, Tiffany. And that's correct. It's prayer and pledge. The next item of business is to review and accept the meeting minutes from October. I appreciate Gerald taking over for October 8, but let's take that one. Let's do each of these separately. October 8. Does anybody have any comments or additions?

Ma'am, just very quickly, our city recorder is absent tonight, so please ensure for yourself and those who are here in the community, when we're addressing official business of the meeting, please talk very well into the microphone so we can catch up for the recording. Thank you.

Do you have any questions or comments on October 8 city council meeting minutes? I'd no. No. If if not, I'd look for a motion to approve the meeting minutes from October 8. I'm not sure we approve the minutes as written. Got a motion from Tiffany, a second by Second that. From Stephanie. Any other discussion? All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed with nay? Motion carries five zero. October 16 was a quick, short special meeting. It's a short agenda, but we'd be looking to approve those meeting minutes.

If anyone has any questions or make a motion. I'll make a motion that we approve the minutes for 10/16/2025.

Got a motion from Garett to approve the meeting minutes, October 1625. Is there a second? I'll second it. Got a second from Dave. Any other discussion? All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed with nay. Motion carries five zero. The next item on the agenda is to approve the agenda. If the council would allow, we have a item seven b and seven eight. If you would give me some liberty to be able to we'll follow in this order, but then I after we discuss seven eight, I would like you to go back to seven b on the if there's any action that you want to do. So I those are tied together, but it's broken up because

of of I'm I'm confused, ma'am. Action items and and And discussions. I'm confused. You said seven a and b No. 77 B

where we're going to be talking about Right. The person's splitting a subdivision. But 8 A 8 A. Okay. Is very much tied to

I mean, what Right. Happens in 7 B. Okay. I thought you'd said 7 A. I just Okay. I I might have. Okay. Yeah.

So we'll follow the agenda, but I wanna be able to go back on one so we can have some clarity when we go back to it. Other than that, it's not a change to the agenda. I just wanna be able to have you have some more information and then go back to that one potential minor subdivision. I'll make a motion to accept the agenda. I've got a motion from Kirk to accept accept the agenda.

Second it. And a second from Stephanie. A quick clarification, mayor. Was that

the the agenda as amended or is it spam? Not gonna not gonna amend it, but I just wanted them to know that I'm gonna I'll probably leave that one discussion of seven b open, go to eight a, and then go back to seven b. Okay. So with liberties

With a little

latitude there. Got a motion from Kirk and a second from Stephanie. Any other discussion? All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed with nay? Motion carried five zero. The next item is to receive resident input to the council and to myself. Let's have you if you would come to the microphone limited to three minutes, it's time for you to provide us some input on things that may be concerned. The council may not necessarily be responding at that time. Some things we'll have to take back, and and maybe there isn't a simple easy solution now, and we gotta figure things out. And but we want to receive that input. So if you'd come to the microphone, we'd all received a couple of handouts. Yes. Those are my handouts.

And I will try to keep my comments to three minutes. In fact, I'm putting the timer on. It's okay. We got a big clock. We got a gong. You know?

There's a trap door just

Right. You're trapped.

So thank you for your time. I appreciate being here and and commenting. As I walk up and down Center Street, I I meet my neighbors, and Some of the issues with the new construction have arisen, common issues. And I put together the notes you all have, and I'll I'm just gonna read through those. I'm sure these aren't all the concerns, but I've Yeah. Some interested other neighbors here, then they may wanna comment at the line, but I'll just read through them. This is concerns regarding Center Street construction. I have several concerns regarding the recent construction along Center Street. The newly installed curb and gutter appear to be out of compliance with Hyde Park City code. Page two of your handout, I believe is the code. And if that's not the code, you can invite me on that. But I think that is code for Hyde Park City. If there's a new a new building going a new home going in, that's what the council or that's what the building code requires. I think that's what it is. But if I'm wrong, you can correct me. The slope from the sidewalk to the curb and gutter are significantly steeper than 2% the 2% requirement. Based on my measurements, and I'm not that great at math, but I did the best I can. Slopes range between 1018%, which is much too steep for vehicles to approach safely without risking damage. Many of us have vehicles with this much clearance. I measured my vehicle, and it's this much. So as you approach off the road and go up that incline that is between 1018%, there's gonna be problems. This issue appears to be consistent across the driveways, all driveways along Center Street where any construction has occurred. In general, the curve does not align with the sidewalk. In some areas, it's too high. In some, it's much too low. But for the most part, it's much too low. I also have concerns with the new water pipe that's been installed within an inch of the existing line, which could be problematic. One of my neighbors has already experienced the crushed sewer line, which I'm sure you're familiar with. This has resulted in sewage backup and flooding in their basement. I know my neighbor's pretty frustrated. My wife and I are frustrated because we've suffered from some damages at our home, and it's cost us $4,000 to make those repairs. I'm wondering how these frauds will be addressed before inclement weather prevents further work. If construction is not completed according to Hyde Park City code, what contingency plan is in place for effective residents along Center Street? What is the plan for addressing any unforeseen consequences that might that might arise in the future? When will the mailbox is being installed? Three minutes is up. And who is responsible for the parts strip? What material or landscape will be will that be filled with? And in the end, what happened, and how will it be fixed?

Thank you for allowing me to go over.

Thanks, Blaine. Is Is there any other comments that we'd like? Cody, you're one you you I could see you nipping at it.

I I'm frustrated because

I can This is this is Cody Johnson. Oh, Cody Johnson.

I come down for the sidewalk meeting last year and asked the question, do we know that the grade's correct? And I was assured that they had had an engineer and that the curb would match up with the grade of the sidewalk.

I believe we had an engineer here at the time too when we had that discussion. Yeah. Two engineers.

Both from Sunrise. Yes. And so I I know complications, but I also noticed the curb is poured up over the the bridge, which I've never seen that before ever. Why would you put curbing over the bridge? Down here? Or No. Right up here. Right here at this point. Yeah. The curb's poured up over top of the bridge, which doesn't even make sense if you're draining into the canal, which used to be the canal, there should be a port. So as stewards of the monies of cash value, the monies that were given for the grand, I I just think it maybe we jump the gun doing one before the other. And I asked that specific question, why don't we wait to do the sidewalk until you get the curb and gutter? Not sure that it would be matched up. So that's my concern is that we've wasted all this money. There's gonna be more money wasted trying to remedy the situation that's there plus the times. I mean, we are told that it'd be finished before the July, but now we're in October. And then they haven't even they're not even close. My sister-in-law, Betty, has been ten days. Her car in her driveway, no way to get across the driveway to get out. She was told it'd be done tomorrow. She said I'll be okay for seven days. But, I mean, they're gonna have to come and build her bridge because she can't go anywhere. And in case of emergency and I've got handicapped neighbors that have the same problem. So

Thank you, Cody. My concern. Thanks, Cody. Anyone else? Brad?

Yeah. Brad Atkinson. I'm the neighbor that got the sewer thing in the back in their basement. I I agree with Blaine, though. The concern is with the curb and gutter that why how can it be that if when this when Moses's company come in there first and did the sidewalk and assured me that this is to the top of the grade top of the crown of the road to the his measurement. That's exactly what he said it had to be from the crown of the road to the sidewalk. And then when the gutter guys come back, they they take supposedly take the same measurement. How can it be so far off? I mean, you follow that sidewalk, and there's there's a foot difference all the way up the sidewalk, up and down all during that sidewalk. And Jepsen's house, for example, they gotta tear up all the sidewalk there. There's no there's no question they gotta do that because as you can't even see the sidewalk from the road, the curve is so high. So I don't know who engineered this process with this project, but, obviously, somebody screwed up. The second concern I've got is because of sewer. When they replaced my sewer line, I took all these videos and pictures, you know, of where that blue line with the new water line sits with in in relation to my my sewer line. And there's less than a half inch gap between that black blue line to my sewer line. Less that they had to get get a shovel with a crowbar and push all the the sand between the two of them to get even to replace the sewer line. Line. And that's with an empty sewer line, an empty blue line. With that blue line, your new water line is still with pressure on it, and all this compassion is going on now. I just foresee a lot of problems coming down the road. There's gonna be everybody else's sewer lines with the same kind of problems with all the compaction and things that's gonna have to happen in order to get this project finished. So I don't say a lot of things about if and when, but I don't think this is gonna be if it happens. I think it's gonna be when it happens because of the clearance that I saw in two different neighbors' place with that blue line to this to their sewer line. So somebody ought to reconsider and look and see what they can do about the curb and gutter and also with the sewer lines because there's gotta be a certain amount of slope on the sewer lines to the main line, and everybody has that same distance. And the houses are the same distance apart apart about it, posted it from the crown of the road to the houses. So I know the sewer lines in most of those houses are exactly the same as far as height wise to that main line, which is on the South Side Of Center Street. So in my that's my biggest concern is the sewer. And the second thing is, yes, we have a problem with the the set with the sidewalk versus the curb and gutter. Thank you. Thank you.

Anyone else wanna speak? Maureen.

Maureen Hearns. I just wanna, first of all, support my my neighbors that have commented on things tonight. It it certainly has impacted all of us on Center Street for a long time. The last item on the handout that you received was about the parking strip. They And in most areas along Center Street, 95% of it, that parking strip is about 12 inches. On the corner of 2nd Eastern Center Street, it's about eight feet there because of the way the sidewalk was laid and the way the curb and gutter was. And I'm curious as to what will happen with that old drain that's still there if that will be taken out and removed. There's a drainage pipe that still runs underneath 2nd East there on that corner. And just just concerned a little bit about the stability of that and how that's gonna be addressed. Yeah. That's that's pretty much it. So thank you for your time. May I have the rest of my thirty minutes? You got two minutes. I and I'm just wondering if it's possible that those of us who live on Center Street might receive a little bit more timely communication and updates for things that are happening and when to anticipate them. That's we've been kinda lost a lot of the time during the summer because we were told certain things and then it didn't happen. And we hear it from so many sources. So if it could come from you, from the council, then that could be the word. Thank you.

Anyone else have a comment?

I am it's Dallas, Charles. I'm one of those whose approach is going to be too steep. And I drive a Honda Civic, which sits really low to the ground, and I'm worried about damaging my car trying to get into the sink. And I'm sure that Steve Corbett would never get in to my driveway when he comes to visit. So that that's really my main concern, that I have an approach that I can get in and out of without worry.

Thank you. Thank you, Dallas. Any other comment? Not we'll close it. And I just oh, I was gonna say I I was just gonna say, and it's good to see Janelle here. I haven't seen her forever.

That's a good problem. We're waiting to make sure you got all of them on that one. Okay. So okay. I'm Janice Rowland, and my husband and I are here talking about the street that I moved to a year ago on 450 North in 7th East.

I didn't know you moved. Okay.

Neither. So anyway, this is very dangerous. I don't dare back out of my driveway because the way the hill is, you know, goes up, you can't see who's coming, and they're coming down that hill very fast. There's no stops. It's the only East West intersection that goes all the way down without any stop signs and so Which which It's the part east and over. How far east? 7th East. 2450 North, 7th East. So it's the last street over. You go up. Do you know where snows live? Are you on the That's the canal. Yeah. You Yeah. On the other side of the canal, east side? Right. Okay. So they come barreling down there. And from our driveway, you can't see two seconds above. I start walking across with the dog, and I've almost gotten hit a couple times because all of a sudden, the cars are there. They're coming so fast, and they don't see you. And snows across the street. They they almost many times they have to somehow switch around and come out forward. They can't even back out onto it. My husband had a a measuring device to measure the speeds, and he he met the median speed was 33.5. 9093% this is on the sheet there. 93% we're reading in excess of the post at 25. The school buses just tear down there. I do yoga and I can see them coming down there every morning. They come down all the way from the top. There's no stops and they're so heavy. They are just barreling down there. And we talked to the neighbors, thirteen thirteen neighbors who were on that street. We nine of them responded with none of them they all said things like insane speed, 100% on board. Finally, they said that a lot of them said that they have called and talked. And Ford didn't respond, but no one was opposed to it. All of those neighbors are struggling getting out of their driveway. They are at least lower than us, so they have the people coming down can at least see them. But where where where we are right at the crest of the hill, they can't see us. They're coming down and they'll swerve around us all the time. And I try and stay over here until then I just gonna because I'm right. Someone's gonna hit into me. Let's see what else if I got another minute here. We're thinking that also so many people cross the canal cross the street there because they're walking along the canal. They cross the street there. And I I do that too with the dog, and that's another place you that's where they almost get hit too because that you can't see them until you're right in front of them. So my husband's gonna say a little bit more, but thank you. Thank you.

It's good to see you, Jim.

Did you handle those out, Kirk? No. Come. Come. Alright. Well, this is a nasty intersection with hidden hidden driveways on it on the westbound side. Coming up, it's not as bad, but that was still 60% of the people we're speeding. I think the median speed on that was 27 miles an hour. Top speeds that I measured just in two days, about two hours each day, 46 miles an hour in both directions. Graham's at the bottom of the hill said when the you had the cock cam up there. They saw 75 on it. I've seen some bicycles doing over 50 elsewhere to it. They went ripping by me like you can't believe. It's just out of control. It is literally the only East West direction where the streets come on to 700 that is not blocked by a stop sign. And I think that attests to what the problem is. You might need more than that. You need crosswalk identifiers and probably assign hidden driveways because this is way out of control. I'd like to live at least another ten years. And I'm probably not gonna pull it off if I keep pulling out and going in that direction. If I go east or west, you're really taking your life into your home, especially right before church starts on Sunday and right when school is about to start. Everybody's heading down the hill and then they're coming back up. There are times that it's really bad. Most of the big trucks apparently are going that way because they can't get up this road, so they're plowing up. And I'm positive that's why the number on the westbound or eastbound was lower because I had some of those trucks in there. To be fair, I took every reading that came across my camera when I did it. So I'm guessing that's probably closer to 35. But when you've got a road that you have 93% of the people exceeding the speed with a median of almost 35 miles an hour. And if you look, I gave you pictures of the school bus. That's got all our kitties on it, and they shouldn't be doing anything near that. Now, I've you know, some places I'm agreeable you could speed and that does happen. You can't go down that hill without riding your brakes and it's hard on a car. You've gotta have a way to stop and restart. You might need to even consider what on 600 East. But we need something done. What's the next step?

K. Thank you. That was my question. Well, and and we'll get the council to that. We're we don't field questions during let people if anybody else I imagine you're gonna be the last one to speak because y'all waited for the others, and then I'll have the council speak to the items that would that I'll have some feedback.

Oh, if the council would like to speak to you, I know I have some items that I could speak to on. I think I could speak for the safety committee, Dave, that we will look into this, and we will report back to you for you. We will? Yeah. So Alright. Do it quick because

it's a mess. Yeah. But I back until they start putting the rest of the houses up there. I know a phone call will be made tomorrow to the school district about the buses speeding

because They're the least of my problems. They only go by twice a day. Oh, yeah. But I enjoy

anytime I can. I love that relationship.

Alright. Whatever. Could you leave write your number here, and we can get Yeah. I didn't

You can just put it by 49969324.

Or you can have my neighbor Oh,

okay. Would you make sure that that phone number does not show up in city meeting minutes? Why? Because it's

I don't answer it. So

Well, we've already called you then. We'll we'll leave a message we'll leave a message. I

know. Saved my life. Well, wait. Hang on. We'll we'll have I'm gonna close this and have some discussion with the council, and perhaps you'll receive a little more input. So if there's any other comment? If not, we'll close the public input because this is one just two people on this one. There was at one time, Marcus, we moved the stop signs, didn't we? Oh, yeah. And and the stop signs were going east west. K. We had you you would have thought we we just kicked over the apple cart. Do we have a lot of residential pushback on that? And now this is why. This is we we had the stop sign at that point. Having a stop sign at the 70450 North going north really is we also gotta stop saying going south too, but nobody comes from the south. Right? Or from the north going south. Very few if they make a turn, they

but Yep.

Perhaps this is is one that in the interim that the safety committee takes this one up as well. We have some data from the city, from the police that they put along 700, and you're not even close to the top speed. And so we that's why we formed a safety committee because we need to slow traffic up. So one thing that as a as the committee, we need to have the document of the formation of the committee come before the city council to get that approved. And then in that same meeting, we can have the first recommendation of the four way stop at 450 North and Fort East be spoke about to the city council. That is also a challenge there as many people know that, But the safety committee needs to take this one and take this forward. Long term long term at that intersection, we thought it would be a perfect place for a roundabout. A little one? Yeah. At the at 700 Yeah. A little 450 I think really to slow people up

Can I just comment on that? Go ahead. I drive down 450 and turn on Seventies because I live just above there, or I go down 450 and I will say you don't see, you don't see cars backing out. I think that the stop is more important than a roundabout. I think it needs to be a stop because of the canal crossing, because of the way people are using the road and the angle of the drop. You can't see going down. You can't see cars coming up. Every day I drive down, and I turn on 7th East, and I pray that no one's coming up and gonna T Bone me. It's that it's really bad. Perhaps it's a flat rather than the roundabout because that's a ton of money. The flashing lights what we have on 70160

by Phil Calley's house, something that flashes that gets people's attention.

It's a it's a danger it's become a more dangerous road over the fifteen years we've lived there. As the as it's grown and it's become busier, it's becoming very dangerous.

Yeah. Is there's data

is that from the one that shows you as you drive up to it? It also records it, and we have we have

a plethora of But it's in box. It will well, it'll show it. Well, it also gets also gets yeah. We we realize that, but it it'll measure it long before it flashes up there.

And and it does it both directions too. So coming the other way, it'll it reads it reads both ways.

And the amount of traffic and the peak times and all of this stuff so that we can make better informed decisions. And and we I know the safety committee has has said much about and had a lot of input of people speeding in town, but where we're finding other than four Northeast, it's our people. It's us that's doing that speeding or or people above you or going up to there and and

and

I pulled my truck to the top of that road, looked at neutral. I was doing 45 miles an hour through that intersection Yeah. When I had the brakes. We got that on record. Right? We can still issue a fight say this. Is this This is all being live streamed to YouTube. So it's on the Internet forever. I'm just saying.

Yeah.

You'll pick up, you know, a lot of the next one. So you're riding your brakes all the way down. That's the only way you can stay under the street belt. So council members, Gerald and

Dave, are both on that safety committee, and we have five, six people on that. So the this is definitely one that is the next point of attack, but we What's the current Okay. Yeah. Counsel, concerning the the grades on the street, do you have any comments? There's there's much of which I'll say I had a very clear conversation with Sunrise this week. Would that accurately define Marcus on this? Okay. And I think there's more things to be discussed as far as the law that we need to discuss and get back to you. The city, we we struggled as as you are the recipients of telling you, oh, this area is going to be closed because the contractor is going to work at this time, and then it doesn't happen. We've told them we're no longer going to let people know because they don't follow through. We're just why would we why would we tell you that something's gonna happen when I I don't believe it. Why would I tell you that? I just I believe it when I see it happening because we've struggled immensely with this contractor.

Well, that's why we put it back on them the most recent work, they were supposed to go door to door and deliver letters to people and let them know personally what was going on. So I sure hope that happened.

Oh, yeah.

Twenty third. I'm gonna tell you and when I heard that date too, I laughed, and I was looking for anybody willing to put a Benjamin on it. It's not going to be October 23, so

that's tomorrow. The twenty twenty day. It it's

what is it's it better be what we hear this last week So Marcus

There were a few changes that were made to the the schedule and with some breaks that happened with some unmarked services as we heard about. There were a few additional days added to the contract. The now the date For asphalt? The date for asphalt is Friday. This Friday. It was supposed to be tomorrow. We were at a construction meeting when they got a phone call from the paving company saying the paver broke down, and they were fixing it as fast as they could, but they're moving the paving date to Friday.

I I can't remember who the paver DWA contracted the asphalt out to somebody. There's only a few of them like LeGrande Johnson or Staker that does that. But I'm pretty sure that's who it is.

So, yeah, the substantial completion should be reached next week. Will it be? We're not sure. And that's the discussion that we have to have with the contractor. The contract does allow for the city if we can prove that there's damages that the city is sustaining by going over schedule, there's an option that we have to seek some sort of compensation from the contractor for that. And so we are looking at what that would mean for us right now. Scheduled

schedule a lot of things

Yeah. That's Brad, you and I sat there and watched when they were fill backfilling out in front of your house, and there was nobody there verifying compaction.

Yep. By hand. Under the sea. Shit. You're working with the ship with my law.

Let the record reflect crappier.

And I I told you, this is all

Yeah. But it's true.

Fix this. Fix that. One guy's calling me a bunch. The city spent this, not even licenses. We're paying for this. It's tax dollars.

Oh, so

Mhmm. Well, I'm fixing the twenty fifth. Yep.

Mayor, is pulling. Is the issue is the issue engineering, or is the issue construction completion? Like, is it on the construction company, or do we are we having engineering that says no?

There's issues all around.

There's fault.

The this contractor is challenging. Internet lives forever. They're challenging, and and as some have brought up and I've brought it up earlier this week that elevations that we said were there, Why are they where they're at? Now park strips, there there was another question that was asked about who's at the Park Strip. Every everywhere around the city, the homeowner takes care of the Park Strip. I do that in front of my house. Is it the city right away? Some of those stakes that you saw in the yards, the the actual city right away extended far deeper into the yards than where we put the sidewalk. Usually, it's one the sidewalk is placed at one foot off of the right of way. We opted not to do that because I I walked with some people, some of the residents along there, Brad and Marie, where that would be. We didn't wanna do that. We'd be having a completely different discussion or not necessarily discussion. I it it extends far beyond that. That's not what we wanted to do. Not only that, it would be a significant cost. It would elevations would be way off. And what are we going to do with all of that surfaced area of between the the crown and where the curb or where the gutter and the sidewalk could have been? We want it to be the least impactful, yet knowing it is impactful. We wanted we wanted to make the least painful way. Their timelines are haven't worked out well for us, but that day is fast approaching, and we're compiling as Marcus said, if if there can be damages, you have to be able to quantify what those damages are. So we're looking to figure this out. They're supposed to put asphalt Friday.

Mayor? I'm

I'll bring anybody a Coke on Friday if it's down.

So

If if we have the asphalt done,

have we solved the slope problem? No. Yeah. That does that make sense to have that that's

Some of the some of the problem on the sidewalk, we we had safe routes to to school money for another place in the state. And we said that that other place wasn't going to happen. And the state said, can you put it somewhere? It would be difficult coming back. That was a grant from the state, which is still ends up being our tax dollars. And so that's when we came up with the plan of we need to get a grant for sidewalk. We need to do a grant for the well, for the a different grant for the waterline and be able to have this all come together. Fortunately, we got all the grants, not in the right orders, and there was a sunset on this on the sidewalk money that if we don't use it and get it put in, it goes back. That's why it went in when it did. And so we knew that in front of across the canal. Yep. Yeah. Camille Jepsen's. We knew that one was going to be a challenge. We knew that when that went in. Outside of that one, these are your frustrations as well as the frustrations I am feeling it as well and have been in discussion with Sunrise on how this can how this can be improved. What can we do? So I'm I recognized it earlier this week after I come back, and I didn't know that I figured some would come down after I saw what I saw. I didn't know everybody come down, but that's good because

it's

So you're more than two men.

Yeah. Well, tell them at our next city council, it's on a Sunday night. And

we

it's frustrating for me personally because I know y'all, and it's happening to not only it's happening with the city, I know y'all, and and there are people that we have as friends where I mean, I've walked that sidewalk. I get it. I understand it. And so it's frustrating.

Mayor, so has the elevation of the road that they're going to pave changed that dramatically from what it was before? Because I presume the sidewalk, gutter, road all matched properly, and now it's not. So I'm I'm Is that engineering?

Maybe not a question. I I would be the answer that I got on Tuesday, but I now I want to bring them out and visually see what we're seeing because the elevations haven't changed. I mean, it it we intentionally kept the crown of the road because we didn't want to have to rebuild a crown. We knew that there was gonna be a certain slope. So based on that slope, based on the curve, we should know the elevations. Right. And that's where I'm Okay. Challenged. Okay. So I think tomorrow's probably a phone call to Sunrise and alright. Let's not talk I want you to see what we're seeing. So

Okay. Big. And I think that's not really

Well, kind of catastrophic. I mean, that's we're talking about a curve and a gutter. Catastrophes are massive, but I guess it it and it's all on perception on who it's happening to. Right? Now I'll tell you from our perspective, nobody's been told not to talk. It's more along the lines of now that we see how it's all coming together, we don't know how come how come what we see is not what we perceived in the meeting last year when everybody come down here and what we were assured. So that's we have the same questions. I don't it's more along the lines perhaps some of us don't know and and what answers we're getting aren't really answers.

Yeah. Thank

you.

Where are mine? Bar line in the city of Greenwich?

No. Well supposed to have spot. No. It's it's a sewers it's a sewers service. It's a serve No. It's a sewer service Service line. Going over to the house. It's not the newer main. It's the service line to his home. It's not a main. They're they're in separate trenches.

What what are you

It it crossed over the top to get to the home. It's not office.

Oh. Yep. No.

It's close. Right. The sewer services is above. Yeah.

K.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

That makes guys drop. That's in essence 300.

Yeah. So What? Let's get let's make a note and have this be a discussion item on our next city council meeting. This needs to come up, and I don't think these people would like to wait till that lot that bar. If you've signed your name back here, if any one of you would put I I know how to get ahold of Brad, but if we can come up with what's going on and what we're being told, we certainly can try and articulate that and get it into an email. If you want us to send that to you, please do. I will I'll make sure that it I mean, I know most of y'all. But Is there

unofficial spokesman in your group you think would get it out to everyone? Blaine?

Oh, dude. Okay, Blaine.

You've you've been you're the neighborhood watch commander. Well, if we can give it to you, you you can I, you know, I don't want Cody showing up at my doorstep? I parked my truck too many times in his driveway for parades.

But all the beer.

Yeah. Well Gotcha. But we we also have frustrations and may not be the same frustrations as, like, what Brad's experienced, but that frustration, I understand it. And it's as I talked to Brad earlier, it's frustrating me, and we're gonna figure it out. And it the damage that Brad Brad shouldn't be the one have to wait for that. That should if we have to fight with the contractor, that shouldn't be Brad's fight. That's our fight. So that's why we took care of part of it, and we should have done it differently now that Brad brought up how it's how they're coming back to him. But we'll get information. We don't meet again till, I think, November 12, something like that, and I don't want you all to wait that long. So we'll get something. When we can get some information, I'll feed it on to Blaine. And if you disseminate it, we'd appreciate them, Blaine. Yeah. Alright. Thank you. And the drain the drain is gonna be there. There's it's supposed to be there to go underneath the road at the the drain at your house that goes over to the west side of the road? That one? Maureen?

How do they put a drain in her? The old one. One of those.

One's in the top. The new one's supposed to connect to the pipe.

I think one's fired in further. It's about four or five feet further. And that one connects, you know, goes up on the other side of the street. It's the one that's about four feet north of that. It's been fogged for, like I say, the last ten, fifteen years. That should be removed, shouldn't it, Marcus? That's gonna be in the asphalt out in the road. I do not remember if that was shown to be removed or not in the plans.

I would assume it was it should be removed, but I don't know how that was shown in the plans. Yeah. Look. Hopefully, the theory is there's not gonna be that much water getting to there because it's We'll include that in some information.

So yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah. We'll get some more information on that one and put that in there as well if, Blaine, if you'd make sure Arin gets on that dissemination as well. Alright. Well, thank you everyone for this is how it's supposed to work. Come in and voice issues and let the council hear them. They may not have all the answers. That's we we typically don't, but we know where to go to get the answers, and we and you expect us to have those answers. So we'll do that. So at some point, I'm hoping there's asphalt down there long before there's snow. I think they're worried about the slope.

Yeah. Yeah.

Okay.

It's a it's a foot and a half rise from the top of the curve to our neighbor up the road to the top of to the inside.

I need to come up and walk some more. I I looked at it from down there because I'm one of the few people that obey the road closed signs. Don't I didn't actually drive down it. But Yeah.

No. No. No. I got saved up. I'm going down on the street.

So

I was trying to go in the lobby. It left.

How can you drive down? Would you remember to go back and

I'm gonna Lane, you don't do anything anymore. Right? You retired? Oh, you're still for it? You're consulting? Well, I'm gonna come and walk up that way tomorrow, walk along there and take some pictures because I wanna share. Yeah. It's very kind of a lot. I see something.

That would be so difficult.

I know in my experience, every time I go anywhere, I see infrastructure. I have bad things. So we'll we'll get some try and get as many answers as we can because I think you guys deserve it. So

I don't have them right now. I know that. Stay more. We have them in all of our Oh,

yeah. You'll be worried about your homeowner's insurance. Alright. Well, thank you. We're gonna move to the next item on mayor and staff report. Marcus, what have you got to report?

I don't necessarily have any specifics I would like to highlight for the council today. But if there are any questions about any items on the staff report, I will take them from you. Any questions regarding any items of the staff report?

Yeah. I have some questions on under your road section, by the way. Thank you for doing this. This is so helpful, Marcus, to have these notes.

And And I got it to you a day before the council meeting instead of an hour before this time. Yeah. You we're improving. You you're on it. You're on it. No. There's there's a a lot of good stuff,

and, really, it has to do with the the signage. Mhmm. And and I look at all those, and, yeah, those are all good things to do. And my question my question would be, you know, before I could I certainly think, you know, school zone things are priorities. To really make a decision, I guess I'd wanna know the cost for each of those signs. You know, when we start looking at the radar signs in three or four places and and, you know, flashing crosswalk signs, just

just to know. I mean, certainly some of those are more important than others, and I'd be happy I can give you ballpark prices. I've got ballpark numbers. So a rate flashing radar sign, if you buy a bulk order, they can come in at about 3 to 4,000 a piece. Flashing crossing signs or stop signs, you're looking at about 5,000 a piece. The crossing ones come in a pair, so it's 10,000 per pair. And we have to do a solar because if you do an electric, we have to get it. The electric is cheaper, but then we have to call Rocky Mountain Power and they come out and do a service and they charge us for those electrical services, which ends up being more expensive than just doing the solar array. K. So we prefer the solar. And then your standard street signs, we can get those from SignPro. If we do a bulk order, depending on how many it is, anywhere from, like, 60 to $80 a sign up to a 1 or $200 per sign just depending on how many and how unique they are. But those are relatively

inexpensive, all things considered. Your your standard road signs. Okay. I know we've talked about some of these on the safety committee and just needing to know what the budget is. I mean, I'm happy if, you know Right. Work with Gerald on that and and just come up with some final recommendations.

And we have our road fund that we plan for every year. Typically, we try to save as much of that money as possible for large projects such as road replacements. We have one right near your home we need to deal with. There you know, chip seals, other things like that. But a chunk of that money last year, we did end up putting towards a large sign replacement Right. Citywide. So if that's something the council wants to work on, we can shift some of that money there. There's also some small set asides that we budgeted for for what we're calling the pet projects or the, you know, the things that come up that we that the council just wants addressed right now. So there's money built into the budget for these things, but we as a staff have just had so many requests that I wanted to turn it over to you, the the those who represent the people to tell us what you would like to do with all the requests. So, you know, it doesn't have to be decided right now. We just need some direction before we start ordering signs for everybody. I think I know what you're asking for. And, you know, if if you're

if you have a here's the gross amount of dollars.

Here's our shopping list. What can we get at what cost? So Yep. And we get And and certainly some of those are more important from a safety standard. I mean, I Absolutely. I'm just thinking, you know, school zone kinds of things and certainly is important. But, yeah, that's really what what we need is that Okay. Okay. We we can get that. Okay. Thanks. What's wrong with the flashing signs currently at Cedar Ridge?

We have had reports from the crossing guards that they've had issues with them and they're flashing. They've asked the city a couple couple times now for just a new sign because the one is getting very old, and they say that it doesn't work very well. I personally have never seen it not working well during school hours. So Never seen it. The nice thing about those, we have power there already. So Right. And our public works has been down there to look at them. They don't necessarily see any problem, but everybody agrees they're getting old. So it's it was a request from the crossing guards and just something to consider. Okay.

Okay.

Thank you. That's that's the only question I had. Mhmm. Any other questions for Marcus?

No. I'd I'd say from my perspective, I've got a meeting set up for us. Wednesday on coming tomorrow?

Yes. Tomorrow, the school district is coming to meet with the city staff, the mayor. I think there was two council members on the invite. Who was it? Dave and Tiffany. Dave and Tiffany. The school district's coming to officially present their plan for the middle school, or not the middle school. Sorry. The elementary school, because we haven't seen the final version yet even though they're halfway done building the outside of it. But, you know, that's neither here nor there. I specifically told them that we

don't necessarily want to have a death by PDF. We want to see the building plan Mhmm. And we wanna traffic plan.

Right. And one concern that we have is with this new school district coming in, of course, we want to know where the new bus stops will be. That's information we don't necessarily have, how it's going to change the existing bus stops, if it will at all. There's several questions that we have as a staff that we're hoping to get some answers from the school district. And, additionally, we've asked about getting some better signage installed, you know, the flashing signs, the school zone signs, the the crosswalk flashing signs. The school district's initial response to us has been, well, that's not our property. Near the city, you can do what you would like to. I'm not really happy with that response. I would like to encourage the city council to discuss with the school district more productive ways of thinking. You can tell me offline, council, if you didn't like it, but I told them that although they

get all of their approvals through the state, nothing comes building inspection, nothing comes to the city. The only things that the city does control is when and if they hook up to our water and sewer, and they're not doing that until they make make it right with the city. So it's you know, they they can't make their problem my problem. I'm not gonna do it. I'm having it. So that's why I said a call would definitely be made tomorrow because I it's okay. I'm good with that. And and and if council if you're not in agreement, tell me offline. You don't have to I just don't think that High Park City should be bearing the burdens of something that they're creating, so or the residents of our city. So the other thing is we've we've made our final appeal last Was it Monday night for our for our COG grant? Mhmm. Yeah. A grant is being recommended to go forward to be approved through COG, one phase, and, we'll have more to the Cache County Council won't vote on it until they have to approve all the recommendations. I've never heard them not approve a recommendation in all my time with city government. With that said, I still don't wanna announce what it is and everything. So they they should be meeting in November, and we'll announce that as as time permits on that one. That one has gone forward. Other than that, I've

Can can I ask a question?

Oh. So Do you have some?

You're saying that you would like to discuss the core Yes. City and either have a a council or a committee?

Right. And that ended up on our agenda for tonight just because we felt like it needed additional time to discuss. Gotcha. Mostly because I didn't really get a response with the last staff report, so I thought we'd put it on the agenda and have a discussion about it tonight. Yes. But, yeah, part of that discussion is probably gonna end up being a request for some sort of committee or study group outside of our public meetings to look into it. Seven b eight a discussion

cumulative. One one last thing. Tiffany, you you were able to sit in on a meeting we had this week. If you can give us a quick, overview of what's going on. And this this is in regards to a a developer and a park, but, council, you're all very aware of the a firm line we're taking with the developer, but the the potential of a park has been moved to their collaboration and us with USU. So, Tiffany.

So, yeah, USU, landscaping student landscape architecture students Yep. Are they're all juniors. They came and presented some ideas or concepts for the park that could be down in that development. I have I have their presentations if anybody wants to look at them. They're really creative, really good ideas that we could carry throughout the city in the future if we decided we want to implement some of them. They're very forward thinking, highly focused on nature and activity and learning and trails and community activities, really good presentation from the students. And then in next month, we'll be meeting at their studio. And I think can anybody go? Can we all come because it's open to the citizens of Hyde Park? They said to invite the citizens, But can we all meet there as city council members? I don't know.

So the way that the open public meetings act works is if there's gonna be discussion of city business at all, then there needs to be an open and notice public meeting. If all the city council decides to go grocery shopping at Lee's on a Thursday night and you run into each other and you say hi and move on your merry way, that's not considered a violation. But where this is discussing potential city business,

I would hesitate to invite all the council. Let let's look into that because this developer has not been approved on anything for a development. So is it city business because they have zero

approval. I'll check with the city attorney as long as it's just a presentation only. I'll see. I just don't wanna violate any Oh, yeah. I

I just think they have some great ideas. And at least look at the packets they left as a council just to see what they're proposing and and give feedback. And that if we we all can't be at that meeting, we can carry that feedback forward from the council as a whole. I think it would be helpful to them.

Yeah. So Tiffany's got the packets. I think Marcus does. I've got them in the office. You can make copies if we need to. You're more than welcome to. Alright. Let's move on to mayor, can I just say one thing? I before I forget,

I'm not available tomorrow, but on Friday at any time, if you have any meetings with Sunrise or the contractor on the road, I'd I'd love to be there and ask a few questions. So

Absolutely. K. Thank you. Not tomorrow. You're available on Thursday? On Friday. On Friday. Excuse me. Yep. Yep. Okay. Let's move on to

oh.

Six b. No. Yeah. Six b. Holly Baird is feeling that she needs to step away from planning commission. She's got young impressionable children at this time, and she really she wants to stay involved in the in the safety committee, but she really feels like she needs to spend more time with her children, and that's understandable having the the younger kids. So I did happen to have one lady that I forgot. I gotta pull this up. Heather Taylor reached out to me some months ago, and she asked me she said that she wants to be involved in in the city. She's empty nester and has time, and she's done things before. And how do I go about getting involved in the city? And I told her, oh, man. It's quite a process. And she said, what is it? And I said, you have to have desire and ask me. So and since you've already asked and you explained that, but I will pull up she sent Let me pull this up. She sent me an email with some of her information about her. She couldn't be here tonight. She was I'm not sure if any of you know who Heather Taylor is. Nice lady. Key qualifications, she's entrepreneurial leadership, designs, owns, and operated thriving salons in for five years overseeing all aspects of business operations, marketing, finance, staff development, and current over owner of Pepper Clothing. Twenty nine years of of business and operation management, manage budgets, schedule clients, relations, growth strategies. She's recruited, trained, and and worked as inspiration for other employees as they continue to move forward in their career, partnered with architects and designers to design and build a functional aesthetic aesthetically appealing, business, cultivating long term client relationships, honored as Lehigh when she lived down there, Lehigh Chamber of Commerce Woman of the Year in 2007, education. She's completed courses at Snow and BYU. We'll take it though. And focused areas that strengthened in business and interpersonal relations skills. And I I think the big thing is is someone having the desire and wanting to be involved. So that's that's key. You can have the most, you know, pedigreed person. But if they don't have the desire and not showing up and not being involved in it, that's all that pedigree means nothing, but and she's willing to get in and be involved in this. And so what I'd be looking for is some approving consent or not some, but a an approving consent from the council to have Heather Taylor serve on our planning commission. And that would be with motion, I believe Is it a motion? For a proof of consent or or You're just supposed to or you we can we can do the We all say you. Can do the Greeks and do thumbs up.

Yeah. I think you can just

Looking for a proven consent. Yeah. Is there any nonapproval?

I'm just I'm good.

You're good? Good? Tiffany, good? Gerald? Kirk?

I I my main thing is they have the best the city's best interest in in your conversation if that's who she is. That's So my conversation is has been with her is

we need somebody that's although we take care of the immediately immediate needs, we need to be planning for the future, how things are going. If something complies with code, it's hard to not approve it. And if if we don't like it, change our code. Yeah. That's that's the real thing. If we don't like how something is going, we need to change it, modify it, do something, change the code. Because if it complies and you go against it, we're gonna we're gonna

come out on the short end of stick on that every time. I think to the point that Dave makes all the time is is our code and what's being approved supporting our master plan. Right? And if that's not, we we tweak it. That's

And I've I've sent her links for all of that, and we we have a younger planning commission. We have some with experience, but I think the big thing is we have people that are desiring and wanting to be a part and be engaged in the community. And that's that's the important aspect, not coming into it with, I wanna stop all greenhouses from ever being built, or I think we should have a gated city. It's they're coming into it with an analytical, methodical process of thought. That's what I've got from her, and she's wanting to learn it. So she's been to a a few of the planning commission meeting meetings just trying to learn and figure it out as as they go. And one thing I'll say is I I really like that we've got more women involved in the planning commission and in city government. I think that's great. Probably wouldn't be as messed up as what we are, except for Tiffany and Stephanie. So, Garell, are are you good then too? Alright. So we have a proven consent, and I will notify her. And she's gotta complete the training before she can. They've got a meeting next week. Correct?

No. Next week is the Oh, yeah. Next week is the spook Alley. Spook Alley. Public youth. They've

the next item. Marcus, do you wanna take us through seven a to start with? I'm assuming that the are here.

Wait a minute. We skipped the the Waste management. Waste management. I'm sorry. I apologize.

Waste management, you have in your inbox. I gotta pull up my PDF here. There we go. It's time to when we negotiated the original contract with Waste Management, we built in some extensions that they could that we could negotiate and be granted. There's a couple of things. What I'm looking for is your approval for for me to sign for the city to enter into a continued agreement contract with Waste Management. Some things this is a draft. There's a few changes in here. One is it wouldn't be effective until December 1 because we have to have a a rate fee, a weight garbage collection fee change in our fee structure because waste management is tied federally to the CPI with the federal government on on their Pricing. Trans their transportation of waste. And so the government federal government ties them, and that's what the increase is on the CPI. That's that's a federally controlled number that goes into it. So it would be in here, it says October 1, but I called and told them that we can't we can't respond that fast. We have to have a public hearing for the fee structure, And then the agreement would take us to October I can't remember. Was it October '33? 3233.

Yeah. Does that mean that waste services are going to go up in money

and how much? On the on the fee structure, I've got I've asked Colette to figure out how much that is when it says the CPI is five point something percent, 5.41%, I think it was. Figure out what that is so we can have a complete clarity when we have that re rate fee here public hearing in November. Okay. So that but, yes, it it was 5.41, I think, percent. I don't understand

that. Does that apply to every you know, does this apply only to waste management? And then No. It So every Every waste hauler. Every waste hauler. So even our the local ones

Yep. If they're It's tied to the CPI. They they they are required to have that CPI built into it.

What a great business to be in. Goodness, you're you're you're gonna need a an increase every year whether you need it or not. I mean, it's tied to a lot of things that don't have anything to do with waste management. But if it applies to all, then I guess it doesn't make any difference. I mean, I was not here a couple years ago when when we entered entered into this. And so I know that there's other cities, Smithfield, Richmond, Providence. There's some other places in Cache County that are not part of this consortium. Right. I guess the decision was made by the city council that this was the best approach rather than using a local

agency. Yes. If

I mean, my neighbor today said he's tried to call them at waste management a couple times to let them know they didn't pick up his garbage, and he just gets a recording that says, we picked up your garbage at this date and time. You know, and he can never talk to anybody. It's nice to have a local that you could actually talk to maybe. One of the things that has been brought up in our meetings with waste management is that

they they don't know Dave. They don't know Dave's address. They don't know any of that. Hyde Park City does the billing. So they they they have a GIS map. Mhmm. So we're trying to figure out how without increasing the costs, how they can figure this out and be more responsive because we're not the only city that typically somebody gets missed. They contact High Park City, and we end up calling them. But we don't want to be in their business. Right. We shouldn't be in their business. They should be able to call that number and get responsive answers. And I've spoke with the Western Regional operations person for waste management, and he's notes of the consortiums. It's not just us. The consortium's same concern. So that's gonna be an ongoing. That one can't be solved immediately, but that's an ongoing challenge.

Because, yeah, I just not knowing the reasons why they were picked over others, I would maybe say, let's go back and look at what their performance has been in the last two years, and are they providing what we thought they were gonna provide, or do we need to say and can we? I mean, are we tied to this consortium for ten years, or can we just get out of it and say, well Yeah. But you better have a plan. Well, I mean, you you have to hire some other company to do it. I mean, is that even an option? So

And we we thought we had other ideas, and he shared with me a way to do it at cheaper and more efficient for the city to do things. So they've they've been responsive. Of course, I'm call I'm not calling their hotline either. So

Okay. Alright. So

they are citizen. No. I'm very, very impressed with them because the way they always deliver and take take out garbage. But, also, I had my grandson out there watching them one day. He likes to watch trucks. The guy got a house truck, Bob Brooks, with a dumps little model dump truck And it is garbage bin as I gave it to my grandson. And That's his whole day. It's time out. Thanks. That's cool. I don't think he was care about both. It was very impressive to me. I'm very That's good.

And and leaving leaving from keep in mind, we were we weren't leaving the Logan. They they kicked us out. We got a divorce, and we found out they owned everything. So with that, they've they've been they were a big enough company to come in and not be taken not not have Logan rule over them. How's that? They've you don't wanna sell trucks, good trucks at a fair price? That's okay. We got trucks all across the country we can bring in. That's okay. You sit on them. That could that made it a lot more amenable. Plus, in the long term, we also I put into the contract that they need to be going to NG on some of the trucks. Natural. Yeah. So so emissions. Yeah. Yeah. Knock down our emissions in this valley. We know how that gets in Cache County. So Okay. Thank you. So with that, we'll be having a public hearing on At the first council meeting in December. Yeah. Whatever day that was. I think it's a twelfth in in November, and it would go in November and then go into effect in December. But we'll have a clear and concise agreement. But I'm looking for the council's approval to enter into this contract with waste management. All cities have to have that, do what I'm doing. That's why we told them you can't do it in October. We have to have public hearings. And I told them that same thing last year. So do we

make a motion now to enter before we even have a public hearing? So

I was wondering that. So

to enter into an agreement, but the agreement is what sets what the fee will be.

And and then when when the fee is there, then we can have the fee public hearing. I think what the mayor asked for was the council to vote to give him the authority to sign the contract on behalf of the city. Yes. And I would I know that there's an a potential amendment coming to that fee saying that it won't be enacted until December. So perhaps that's the motion is to give the mayor the ability to sign on behalf of the city once the fee's been adopted or something along those lines because then at least we're not holding this hostage and waiting for that to happen.

But I'm I'm just confused, I guess, that we give the mayor approval to sign a contract, and then we're gonna have a public hearing in several weeks because of the raised fee. And if everybody says, well, we don't like it, I mean, oh, well, we've signed a B is an agent. That's a So what happens in that case is the fee goes up regardless, and the city just has to pay the difference. If the fee is anything different than this contract,

we're gonna I'm gonna have discussion with them. So Then the fee is going up regardless. The city has the choice to adopt a new fee schedule to pass that on to each of the residents, or the city can find money within our budget to compensate for the difference. Every other city within the cash waste consortium plans on updating their rates to match that budget so that we're still having the fees that are charged to the residents match the rate the waste management is charging us. And 5% of

15 or $20 for a single garbage can is not gonna be a lot. No. I think it's, like, 2 or something like that. But, boy, that's a great deal across America because I see waste management everywhere.

Okay. Yeah. Good for them. Okay. So, yes, that that would be the if you're okay with it, I'd be looking for a motion to allow me to enter into a contract agreement with the waste consortium on the extension for waste management.

I move that we let our mayor sign the agreement with waste management for a five year extension.

So I've got a motion.

I'll second it.

Does it calculate out to a five year extension?

The contract? Because if it's The agreement? Comes into effect

'26, and it goes through '30.

Well, it's a five year extension of the original contract Okay. Which was I think it was a four year contract, so we're expanding that out.

Yeah. So we've got a motion by Stephanie and a second by Tiffany to allow me to enter into an agreement to sign sign the agreement with the waste consortium with waste management. Any more discussion? All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed with nay? The next item that I've been trying to get to is to consider requests for land use, per land use code regarding a minor subdivision, the applicant from, Todd and Kimberly Nye. This has come up before to the city, but it now is a better time. Mark, as you we have council, we have a lot of documentation, PDFs in there for the NICE. Do you wanna give us the Yeah. I can give a brief digest version of

what they're looking for and why they're looking for it, and it's Yes. And the Nyes are here, and I know they've prepared a little presentation as well they would like to give to the council. Yep. But perhaps when I'm done, you give them some time. The Nyes approached the city. It's been a few years now looking to split their lot. At the time they approached the city, we didn't have the residential core zone, and so it was impossible with the restrictions of the zoning. With the introduction of the core zone residential core zone. Correct. With the introduction of the core zone, it provided a way for them to subdivide their property, but then a different problem arose, which was in our subdivision code, it says that every subdivision is subject to installing improvements. So that means you got curb, gutter, sidewalks, additional asphalt. It it can be quite extensive. And so the discussion that we have had with the NICE is they feel like there are provisions in the code that would allow them to not have to put those in. And then this also speaks to the discussion we'll have later where the city staff feels like and especially the core part of town, these requirements can be quite onerous, and we'd like to have discussion with the council about perhaps amending those requirements specifically for the core zone due to the existing infrastructure.

But If you if you look at in the core zone, there's a lot of 100 foot right of ways. And that means if there's curb and gutter out in front of the Nye's house and not on or on their lot and nothing on either side, where's the city gonna put that water? We've always had grassy swells. Long ago, the city had pushed to get sidewalks installed on the north sides of streets in the Corazon and on the east side of streets, I believe, in the Corazon. West, we we wanted to be able to have where somebody could walk up that street at least and not be in the street on the West side and the North side of streets. This becomes challenging in people in the core zone. So now you know the crux of what they want, and we'd invite the NICE. If you wanna have a presentation, you wanna share that with us, we certainly will.

Can I just ask real quick? The planning commission, have they seen any of this? Have they had this conversation?

No. This originated with the city staff. We've had several discussions with Denias as they've been through the application process for their subdivision, and we thought we probably should get the city council's opinion on if this is even an avenue you want to go down before we start spending the planning commission's time on researching this further.

Okay. Thank you. And I think they're in the whole packet, there's a letter that they're requesting a what was the term used? Mayor, may maybe you should let them I'm just I'm just thinking of what what was the term? Variance

change? No. Not a variance. They're not requesting variance. They're you should just let them talk.

Fine. I was

We met with Marcus and Mikkel last week. And they

have you got something that you're gonna wanna share on screens at all? Or No. Every everything they're going to present is in your Okay. For you to file.

K. So as we were talking with them and we had been going through the code trying to figure out which route to go, in your code 1340 020B, it states that any changes requested by the developer that do not conform to the ordinance can only be approved by city council. So then we ask Marcus, can we please come before city council? Because what we are asking does not conform with the current code, and we want to what we're asking is that we are able to split our lot and build to the current standards of the RC zone right now that are present.

Standards.

There's there's lots of code.

Drop my Yes. Okay. So Chico. Sorry. I've got I've never been here so long. Not that you're intimidating, but I'm just nervous. Okay. We're gonna broadcast it on. That's okay. And so the reason we are asking that is because well, for your code and I I wanna just always refer to the code because that's what the standard is. Absolutely. It's in 1210O2O. That is what you guys define as the purpose of a zoning ordinance. That's why we have zoning ordinances. And it says to an they're designed and enacted for the purpose of promoting the health, safety, morals, convenience, order, prosperity, and welfare of the present and future inhabitants of Hyde Park. And so the current code that Marcus referred to about having city or street improvements is actually not reaching this purpose that it's designed. It's it's not helping our welfare. If we're not prospering, we're having to pay more, so much more

as Convenient for us or the city for many many reasons, which we'll get into in just a moment. But Yep. And we have a personal

situation. Sorry. My Charlie, I'm about to cry. I told him not to cry.

It's okay. Let me explain that.

So we we have a big we have 1.07 acres, which is now able to be split seventy seventy, seven forty nine foot frontage. Plus, let's just split that into two parcels. Well, our old house was one of the smallest in Hyde Park. He's story. Our youngest son is disabled, and I threw my back out. We work daily. He cannot be on a two story house. Anyway, long story short, we tore down our house so we can build a slab on grade, an accessible house for him, for us, with Lyft, whatever we need through the house, single level. And maybe that's why she's getting emotional because the there's conflicting code that they're incongruent to Marcus and Mikhail. They both agree and said that you guys are working on this. And we feel that so I don't think it's Thank you. I know. We feel that with the current I'm not trying to say it again.

That the current code is not consistent with the RC zone that you have, all the standards. Hopefully, in your packet is a map of the RC zone. The green line shows you where the curb and gutter is in the RC zone, which is just Center Street and the city office. The x's are properties that could possibly subdivide sometime in the future based on the frontage requirements that you have. And so we're saying by requiring all of the RC zone to have curb and gutter when they build or when they split, it will make it fractured, and it won't be appeasing to the eye. I mean, you'll go up the street, and they'll like, the mayor said also. Mayor said, you know, there's only one one street. And then what does that do with stormwater? It all rushes into the the neighbors. There's lots of there's lots of different things that are in the code that specify why the RC zone doesn't do that. In fact, it's your last meeting a week ago. It it was on the audio recording. There weren't written in it, so I don't know who was saying it. But it was specified that the development standards, it's different stormwater format there. There are different historic infrastructure pattern when it was created. And by introducing the infrastructure in the space that was not designed for that infrastructure would not be beneficial for that area in the RC zone code, which is in do do you have a question? Oh, I'm sorry. No. Which is in twelve dot one thirty. Okay. It states that if there are no sidewalks, that a sidewalk assessment will be applied if there are no sidewalks to attach to on either side, which is contrary to the minor subdivision code, which requires that we have to do all the street improvements. So we are we were ready actually months ago with loan application. We are wait someone's ready to buy our lot.

Sorry.

This is the only thing that's holding us up. I think that's the thing that we need to do. You guys tore your house down that you had there. Right? Yeah. So you had no house there now? Correct. Moving on the street. We're ready to build a house. Slab on grade. And, of course, part of that is selling a lot to help with the financing of it. Right? Yeah. Yes.

So we'll be retaining the east portion of our locks, selling west, and building that slab on grade. Oh, you haven't built a slab on grade yet? We can't. We can't because

subdivided. This is and we can't subdivide until we decide whether we have to do curb and gutter. You can't stop until this is

taking place. I know. I Where where are you staying?

We are just renting a house, thankfully, across the street. We're not we're not looking for pity, but we No. It is just stand in a situation I just house. That are in similar situations without a disabled child. We're trying to subdivide and stuff, but we're just we're just trying to say that, you know, it's we love Hyde Park. It's beautiful. The old part of town is beautiful. And as you look up and down the streets, I think it would look really an eyesore to me anyways to see one that just you know, one here, one there. It's it's not the community that I think we're trying to build and the the view that we want to portray as Hyde Park that, you know, it's planned out. It's it's thought out and but it's

Speaking of thought out, aside from feelings and thoughts of how it looks Mhmm. Because there are a lot of people who love the way our build part of Hyde Park feels, they don't need that. Point is, in the code dimensions, we follow the master let's see. 12Dot130Dot020E says, in the event that in the event sidewalk is not required across the frontage for the city's master sidewalk slash trail plan, it talks about payment of a sidewalk fee. And I looked at both the master sidewalk, the trail plan, and the road plan. They don't charge. We see on the master road plan, it calls for local roads where we live in most of the RC zone, which are typically a 50 to 60 foot right of way. We have a 99 foot right of way, which I heard you talking about budgets and maintaining roads. If we expand those intermittently, I mean, 21 possibly, one is gonna be ugly, stupid, and hard to maintain and costing more of your budgets. And I'm not playing on your words, Marcus, but I do understand budgets with what I do with work. And then the trail plan, aside from the master road plan, it talks about having our street dedicated as a quiet street, which is 66 foot right of way with a sidewalk. And there's already a sidewalk on that

north side. North side. North side.

So it's just it's incongruent. I I think if the city were to try and rework the right of ways according to the master trail slash road plan, it would take a very long time with both you don't have the budgets. You have time, but we don't have time. Other people don't have time, but we're trying to what the code says as Zero nine. We streamline it, and this first page, that right there.

Sorry. We printed the codes because we don't have memorized.

I'm sure you guys know me.

12 dot one thirty dot 10 states the purpose and intent of that section is on residential core is to provide regulated areas for single family residential uses and for continued improvement of underdeveloped or undeveloped lots in the historical core of the city. And, again, it go we go back to the purpose of this relevance to I don't know. Help. Anyway, there's lots lots of stuff, but we just find it very because of that, we're we're hoping that you allow us to move forward without all that stuff that you said it. Was it Sunrise, the engineer, about the connecting I I don't know. New infrastructure to old infrastructure. It just doesn't jive. And listening to the comments before about slopes and water drainage downstream, it it just sounds messy. So

And we just I know from the last meeting anyways, and I'm sure most cities are trying to fulfill governor Thompson's mandate for, you know, affordable housing and whatnot. And in there, he states that the stipulations and requirements for cities to adopt those strategies is to limit allowing ADUs and limiting city rules so that that increase cost. And one of those, he said, was streamlined, permitting so that, you know, you can get a building permit. You can do those things. The approval process, are sped up and for construction to reduce costs. And we're we're not experiencing that. We know that you want to do that, I'm sure, but we're not experiencing that. And if we have to go forward with all the street improvements, asphalt season is over, so that means we'll have to wait till next spring. There's no way that we'd be able to get it all ready before winter comes for that. In fact, if we are able to go forward, we'll still have increased cost because now winter is close upon us, and so we'll have those extra, usually, about 6 to $8,000 fees for Construction. Winter construction, how it works. And the other thing I would ask is, like your last meeting with the canal company that you saw that time was of the essence for that developer, their funding was there, they're ready to move forward, that we would like and would ask that you would see the same for us as a developer, that our funding is there. We're ready to move forward. We wanna beat the weather and that for the Utah code, this is the last one I'm gonna throw in, is Utah code 10 Dash98306. If a land use regulation does not plainly restrict the land use application, the land authority shall interpret and apply the land use regulation to favor the land application. And so it's not plain. You're saying just a sidewalk fee. You're saying street improvements completely. There's a few other different stipulations that are different than those, all in the code, and we would ask that you find it in our favor and put it into action, apply that, that we can just move forward and keep the core zone the way it looks now.

Thank you. Thank you. K. I I would say that the NICE aren't the only ones in this position. There's another one, the Bunceys.

So just for the council's information, whatever is decided for the NICE, there's two other applicants whose letters you have in your packet who are gonna be requesting the exact same thing right behind them. If the council does make a decision, we as staff will take that to mean that's gonna be your decision for all three, and we'll apply your decision accordingly just so we save additional presentations to the council and hopefully can get their process processes moving as well. So please keep that in mind when discussing this item. As the city

I wanna apologize. We we try to do something good. And I think our general plan is good in what we did and looking at the infill, but we didn't follow it all the way down into the codes that that actually affects. We we were looking for that infill in that area and allowing that type of what you're wanting done. But because it didn't follow every code that is affected, We got our own way, which in turn really affects you. So sorry. So and there are other applicants. With that, if you can just hold for one moment, now I'm gonna turn them to have them discuss the codes that are actually that's that's why 88 a eight a is the discussion. And before the council makes any motion, I wanna come back to you guys if that's possible.

Thank you. Thank you. Mayor, I can just start out with a situation that happened at my house. So after I built my home, there was a development that came into the north of me, and they had a home right next to me. And so they had curb and gutter, which ended on the property line. And I had a big pile of water in front of my house for the coming year, and then the city had to come in. I didn't even complain about it. I just drove through it, but they came in and extended the curb and gutter in front of my house to carry that water and then have a drain for it. So it would just create Create more this kind of stuff all over.

Marcus, you wanna take us through that code on eight a?

Yeah. So there's a lot of potential code changes associated with this. We're starting to put together what exactly those would be. The NICE presentation highlighted our biggest concerns pretty nicely. There's some problems with how the codes are laid out specifically for minor subdivisions and the core zone. There's some conflicting things that we're dealing with. Generally, a subdivision in Hyde Park and any other zone, there's a very clear set of rules, which is the lens we were looking through. But as the NICE have brought up, there's differences when you're dealing with the different zones in different areas, specifically around the infrastructure. We recently outlawed the use of flat curb throughout the city because in the rest of the city, we're seeing a lot of highback curbs. Developments are putting in stormwater ponds. That's how they're being developed. But in the core zone, specifically, where we don't have a lot of that infrastructure, one of the things that the DRC had brought up when recommending that change to take out the flat curb option of the code was that they wanted the city council to look at adopting different standards for different parts of town knowing that we have a different infrastructure in those parts of town. Specifically in the core zone, what we would like to ask the city council to consider and we do need to to have some engineering work done on this to make sure it will work, is we would like to have a new standard of development for the core zone. Currently, all of our road standards are found I'll pull them up very quickly. Here in our construction standards road standards, we have nice cross sections for each type of right of way and how the road should be built as was identified in one of the presentations we heard earlier tonight. We would like to create a new cross section specific to the core zone. We have a typical 99 foot cross section, but this is more of a Wolfpack Way style road. And, frankly, we don't anticipate those being built in the city for a long, long time in the core zone. Someday, maybe, but not for thirty, fifty plus years. We hesitate to recommend that the city abandon the right of way, but what we'd like to do is propose a new cross section that essentially would be a limited asphalt section. We're not quite sure how much footage right now, but kind of keeping it the way it is. When development come through, there would be some maybe some type of flat curb just to preserve the edge of the asphalt, maybe not. We're still figuring out which option is gonna be best. But then instead of a a curb and a park strip, having the developers go through and redo the grassy swells in the core part of town as the stormwater conveyance method so that we're not dumping water onto adjacent properties. And so that's really what we're asking for is if the city council would be supportive of the staff working with Sunrise Engineering to do an analysis and put together a potential cross section or cross sections to have a different type of infrastructure in the core zone versus the rest of the city.

I think I think that's just common sense. Right? Okay. And Yeah. You you said something that

I struggled with is outlawing the flat because that's exactly what I said that we should have had on 2nd East when we re asphalt. Otherwise, the asphalt along the edges degrade. And maybe it's not

a Right. Well curb, like, a leaky caveat was in that current ordinance, it could be applied anywhere in town. And so the development that was requesting it was up in the hills, and we were saying, if you put in a flat curb, we're gonna have a stormwater problem. And this particular developer said, that's not my problem. Your code says I can't. And so the recommendation from the DRC was to eliminate that, but to start looking at new cross sections where flat curve would be appropriate. I thought it was a toutlaw that can Well, apparently, it is. Like So serves a purpose to preserve

the integrity of roads when we're just doing asphalt in the core part of town. We should be putting

concrete along the edge of Right. And so the compromise the DRC came up with for the Nyes is even though it's outlawed, it makes sense that maybe we could do a flat curb, but that still means they have to do additional asphalt, sidewalk where it doesn't exist. And so this is where the incongruency happens is it doesn't make a lot of sense as we saw on this map. If we're if we're forcing the developers to update their property to current standard, There's only a handful of lots where the city's going to have the development pay for it. And then the city gets to go back and fill in those gaps, which, as we know, costs Those aren't gaps. A lot of money. Those are blocks. Yeah. It's not yeah. We're filling in blocks, not gaps. And so that's the request of the city staff. The opinion that we have on the NICE request is that it's it's a difficult one because code wise, there are a lot of inconsistencies. But as they mentioned in the land use law of Utah, there's this common phrase we'd say the tie goes to the runner, which essentially means if there's any inconsistencies in the code, we rule in favor of the land use applicant. And so as a city staff, we would be in favor with what they're proposing with a couple of caveats, such as having them redo the drainage swale in front of the home, making sure that's preserved, and then figuring out the situation of the curbing, but we don't really see any problem with excusing the subdivisions happening in the core part of town from a large portion of these improvements if we are adopting a new standard, and that's direction the city's heading. So

I'm wanna ask you. I I agree with that and recognizes that we have two more in the chamber. Mhmm. After that, do we and I hate I I don't think the other eight or 10 people are just waiting to see what these three are gonna do. But is there a way that we just say, address these three afterwards, the city and we can address this in another city council meeting that we put a moratorium until we get more clarity on our codes on on that development until we can make them to be more in compliant. I I hate the term of moratorium on anything.

Yeah. Enacting a temporary land use regulation, which is what it's called in the state code, typically requires some sort of emergent need of the city. When I talked to the city attorney about we had the idea of doing a moratorium on a different part of town with where we're also getting a lot of applications, and we weren't super excited about the code a while ago. And the response I got was essentially, you need to be careful careful about when you use it. It wasn't, Yeah. This sounds fantastic, or, No. Don't do that. It was a before you actually do it, come talk to me, and we'll figure out if it's something that's worth doing. So if the city council would like to seriously pursue a temporary land use regulation and put a stop to new applications while we figure this out, I'm more than happy to have that discussion with the city attorney. I I think we have the benefit

after these three, and they're up against that same issue of winter's coming. So that kinda gives us six months, which is all you can do a moratorium for anyway. Mhmm. So it gives us a six months during the winter to figure out the code and to bring it up into something that we want. So that takes planning commission and then bringing it on to city council, but I think it's very important that we look at that. But there's, like you said, there's three lots there that are that we got in our way and got in their way. We we know what we wanted, but

we We we never know how it doesn't work out until it doesn't work unfortunately. And I I would be in favor of the road standard and the flat curb and the city staff suggestions. I do feel like looking at the core zone and coming up with a minor subdivision standard for just specifically the core zone might be a Mhmm. Just off the top of my head, might be a good way to approach it because we have potential for this happening in other spots. And if it's specific just for this zone, if you're doing a minor subdivision in the zone, it looks like x y z. I think, would be a an efficient way to approach it. Absolutely. Yeah. And so that's Sure. Can you can opt in you

take it you're one of the other two?

Todd Worthy. I'm on the Buncee, that letter. One thing that was brought up when I split my own property twelve years ago that you're gonna wanna look at with the public works is with the flat curb. If you do that, then you've with your swells, what are you doing with the driveways? Two weeks ago, I came to the meeting on Wednesday morning. Mhmm. Was it two weeks ago, three weeks ago? I don't remember. Anyway, Scott with Sunrise mentioned the same thing of, well, if you have that swell, now you have a driveway. And are we now gonna be requiring to put a conduit or a not conduit, but The hole underneath these driveways. Right? The reason that they did away with that before twelve years ago is that the public works were concerned that anytime that they are trying to plow, they're hitting these driveways along with that. And so they're trying to plow to this flat curb and not go into people's property, but then you've got driveways that are along with that that now have a rise in them, and they're destroying their plows. So that's one thing that you're gonna want to discuss with public works is all of that. And that's, again, that's why twelve years ago, they did away with that and decided that, no. Like, if people are doing driveways, if they're concreteing, if they're asphalt on them, then they stay with the camber of the road down into that swell. They drain with the property so that it is able to shed the water and do what it does and and not have ice buildups and things like that too. So something to think

about. Thank you. Thank you. Well, and even with the flat curb, the city would still be saying, we're gonna go in and install flat curb in the rest of this where it's missing. So there's there's still some engineering analysis and discussion with public works to come up with an official cross section recommendation, but these are all things that we've been talking about for quite some time now. So There's

I don't recall anything in our general plan that addresses this specifically in the in the this core zone of other than maintaining the old city feel

and look, but beyond that In in infill and modern inbound housing and how can we best utilize the functionality of our infrastructure that's already there. This this is doesn't save that street, but that's what it's talking about.

I even wonder, you know, thinking about this, is there a plan to put sidewalks on both sides of every street in town? If Well, when do they draw on the lottery up in Idaho? Okay. So so There's only building No. There go. There is not currently a plan to install sidewalks on both sides of the street. The plan is on the north side and the west side. Is that correct? So that when the winter, we get we get the early morning sun is on the sidewalks as soon as possible

and the same thing? That was the plan. I don't currently have anything written down or in our records that say that that still is the plan. Some streets kinda look like that, and other streets, like, well, it's just because they build a house after the code went in, and now we have sidewalks on Yeah. Zigzaggy. And I wanna add something else in one of the things that was brought up was there's an option for a sidewalk fee in lieu in the core zone, and I still would be careful with that. Our city we used to do that very broadly in the city. You know, offered a fee in lieu of option for sidewalks, but our attorney recommended that we stop doing that Yeah. Because the city has if you're collecting the fee, you're essentially making a promise to the applicant that the city's gonna come in and fill in those gaps, and we're gonna use your fee in lieu of to do that. Now the city was using that fee to fill in gaps in the city, there wasn't a consistent plan of where it should be used. And so that's why we stopped doing it. We don't have any more reserve in that fund. It was all spent, and we'd before we could collect anymore, we said, no. We're done. But the same would apply if we resume that practice of fee in lieu of we're making a promise to these applicants that, yeah, the city's gonna come in in a certain number of years, and we're gonna fill in those gaps along your property. Yeah. The other problem too is if they say, oh, we'll we'll put our sidewalk in. Well, where do we tell them where to put it? Right. There's again, there's no There doesn't go anywhere in the road. There's a handful of properties in town. There's one that I always see driving up Center Street where there was a public works director that said, this is where it's gonna be. And then the public works director changed, and then it was, this is where it's gonna be. And so it's been a problem for a while. It's we've been trying to address it with the general plan update. We got very wrapped up in adding new codes and trying to to revamp the application processes, which is what we're doing now. We haven't gotten all the way down to the bottom of the chain reaction yet, which is what I pointed out earlier. One thing I'll just bring up with the Buncee.

Sorry, Todd. But I mean, we have this new school going in there, and we want some sidewalks for our kids to walk home on because they have to walk. So how can we address that? Like, there's certain areas we probably do want sidewalk, but

I don't know. So about too is how do we spell that out in the zone that sidewalks are because some if we require that, we'll have to require sidewalk to be put in with some development if we wanna protect sidewalks to the school.

Right. But if you look at the the buncee,

which one's your corner? Is it is it 3rd. This one? Well, 3rd North and It just so happens, I think, these three are on the South side of streets, so there was never going there's never there's there's no plan to ever put a sidewalk in front of these three that are under consideration. So

Right. That's your problem is Who needs a sidewalk? This If this one got put in and maybe that one got put in in a year and that one got put in in a year, there's still this massive gap that the city now gets to put in, which we can do. We budget some every year to fill in Well, absolutely do a safe sidewalk. But that means we have to go find money to do that, which we again, we can do. It just takes time. Yeah. So the question comes back to what is the city council's goal? What does the general plan say about the area?

So to address Gerald's concern and his great concern, if you recall, Dave kinda came up with where are our sidewalks, and he showed us this map, and that has driven us to that's why I want to have the school provide us their transportation plan, and a lot of kids are gonna be walking there. And now there's no sidewalk on either sides of the street on the on 3rd North and down by where the school is, and they're creating a problem that really highlights our problem. So we're wanting them to participate and help us with that. So I think I think a sidewalk on the north and the west side is is a good plan. The plan long ago caused some consternation. People everyone that was doing infill like this would have to contribute to a sidewalk fund. And then that sidewalk was either put on the west or the north or somewhere else in the city, and that somewhere else in the city really drew a consternation. And it's just they had a sunset on the years, and now the laws have changed a lot. And it's just it's not worth getting wrapped up in all of that. Because now if if you're doing it, it has to be used on their block. And where are you gonna start without having the other four houses? Mhmm. So

it's it's a challenge. So, again, the request that we as city staff have is getting a nod from the council on if you would like us to spend some time working up potential cross sections and doing some engineering and public works analysis to try and identify some recommended changes to the cross section or the core zone. Specifically, with the core zone. Completely in agreement Yes. With doing that. We need to do that. But to address seven v now Right. So acknowledging that's direction the city is is heading, and it's most likely going to be much like what it is today. What is the city council's appetite for continuing For the three there. Right. So currently, the what city staff has told them is you're doing it because that's what the ordinance says. Their point of view is the ordinance is confusing, so you should let us not have to do that. And the city staff's opinion is if we're moving in a direction that changes the cross section or not or not changes the cross section so it stays the way it is, then we would probably agree with the applicants that that's something that we could probably excuse them from. And I would bring up the point that

the this nice said about state code says that if there's any disconnects, tie goes to the runner. Right. And we're not just saying

you don't have to do it, but they did bring up there as the piece of code that says that it the developer can request amendments to their plans that are not directly incongruent. They're directly in line with the code. The city council has the leeway to approve it for minor subdivisions, which is what they are.

Code 13 dot 70 dot 100 exception to ordinance says that we can do so after recommendations of the DRC and planning commission. Can we that? I mean, I'm just this is this is under our subdivision ordinance. Mhmm. Exception to ordinance 13 dot 70 dot 100 where unusual topographic or other exceptional conditions exist. The city council may vary the requirements of this ordinance after receiving the recommendations of the DRC and planning commission provided that such variations will not substantially impair the intent of the ordinance. And that's what my question earlier is if the planning commission I guess, number one, does that apply to what we're doing? And if so, that was kinda my question earlier, says the planning commission looked at those. So this feeds back into the incongruency

of it because the minor subdivision code has a way that the city council alone can make exemptions. Right. But the subdivision ordinance as a whole says you gotta go through the whole process. So if we're looking at the minor sub, the city council can say, yeah. That sounds good. Okay. But if we're calling if we're going with the regular subdivision rules, then I mean, you have the DRC's endorsement. They've talked about it and said this makes sense, but we're bound by the code as we understood it. But all the DRCs said in the meeting with them that it made sense to have that be changed if that's the direction the city council wants to take. This is a minor This is a minor subdivision in my mind. All all three three flexible. All three of these applications are minor sub minor sub Only minor subdivisions are allowed in the core zone. Okay. Right.

So because of the minor subdivision, it takes that thirteen Dot forty. Dot 40 out, and we'd be looking more in line with the thirteen dot twenty. That's the definitions. And and Yeah. Well 13130O20 is infill.

Yeah. There there needs to be some more. And I agree with Tiffany that there ought to be a a separate standalone minor subdivision codes for the residential core. And so I'm ready just to to move that we allow them to proceed in accordance with the intent of our residential core and not require sidewalk or gutter Like, I'd say or additional asphalt? Or additional asphalt even. I mean, just let's subdivide and build some smaller homes on these smaller lots in the core town and not have it look any goofier than some streets look. And would the council be supportive of the city staff working with each of the applicants

to improve their swales and have their storm drainage shift to there where it's supposed to be? I think that's important. Okay. We're only we're only talking about the one, aren't we? Well, we're the city council's voting on one, but the other two are gonna be right behind them saying the city council said. Why. And so the city staff saying it very definite. I I kinda like the idea

of kinda working with each of them to

do what makes sense. So To make it the best outcome possible. Dave, would that motion would you be open But then it will be different. Are you worried because it might be different for each That leaves us in a pickle as city staff. After interview. We would really like clear direction because then we can treat everyone the same. If that thing If that's the case, if that's who you want, Dave's good.

So we had a a motion being formed. I don't know if you wanna finish. Yeah. Once again, so I'll move that. We allow the city staff to work with

the NICE subdivision and the Exactly what he didn't want to. Well, let's No. In order in and not require the standards as outlined in our subdivision code, which For standard definition. Exceptions that they don't need sidewalk, curb, gutter, additional asphalt, that those parcels match essentially the parcels to their east and west or north. Well, in this case, their east and west. And you gotta maintain that Improvement of the and they may maintain the grassy swales

To improve or yeah. That's clear. In in lieu of

curb and gutter and no sidewalks required.

That's clear enough for me. So Is that clear enough? Yeah. We got a thesis on a motion.

Hey. You know Get that motion. Command a few words. And just for discussion, I would like to I think we should get on this and and clean this up and have some clear guidelines that outline what's expected in the future so people don't come with the confusion. But we never know this until we write ordinance that doesn't work, and I appreciate you pointing out how it doesn't work so we can go in and correct it. Yep.

So I didn't quite hear that. That that would be on the plan. Motion from Davis in your second.

We got a second. And and the planning commission will And we'll get this on their agenda to So start working on it. We we as city staff will start putting together concepts and recommendations for the new cross section. We'll start those at the planning commission, and they'll make their way to the city council as soon as possible. K.

Yeah. K. Got a motion and a second. Any more discussion?

Question.

If if we approve this, we're we're also saying that they will work with you Probably with Mikkel, but I guess modifications or recommendations that you have as long as you and the staff are

isn't that what we're saying? Yeah. You're essentially giving the city staff the ability to work with the individual property owners and waive the requirements for infrastructure that don't make sense and don't match with what's existing

k.

Which is what we need. That's what I said.

Yeah. But why say it short in one sentence when you can say it in a pair? Because because he's got the experience here. I'm I'm learning. Alright. Got a motion and a second. Any additional discussion? All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed with nay. Motion carries five zero. I the only thing I would say is let's let's move with expediency Yeah. For what we've been holding them up, and let's get them moving. There you go. Thank you for coming. And let's get there's Mikael's got a list of codes that her and I were speaking about today. One of them was developers, and we had this discussion sometime ago about waters or fee in lieu of just changing it to make it say water. They have to provide it. So she's got a list of codes that So we're just adding to her list? It it it added to her list because I'm not sure if it goes in front of one a or one b. They're all important, but I think their general plan was right. We just when we were updating and we updated lots of codes, we just didn't get We're still chasing down the ripple effects. Yeah. There's still Plumbness too. That's okay. New zone for us and Right. We say it's okay until it impacts somebody Yeah. The way it has. So at least we can move forward and they can move forward. The next item on our city agenda is is we need to have a post session, an executive session to discuss some pending litigation. Alright. Thank you all. For coming. Thanks, everyone. Yep. So

So just as a reminder,

we have to make a motion to move into closed session, stop the recording, start a new one. I'll make a motion that we move into closed

session. I'll second it. Alright. We got a motion and a second to move into closed session, And I think you stopped the recording. Got all in favor. To vote. Oh, and we Yeah. Okay. All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Any opposed with nay?

Alright. Motion carries. And for the benefit of the livestream, we will be ending the livestream and ending the open portion of this meeting. After the closed session, we will resume the normal city council meeting to adjourn. Right. Thank you.

Door's closed. Okay.